Manual shifting is jerky - lurches when I downshift
12-14-2013, 07:04 PM
#21
AudiWorld Super User
I agree....
I do agree that higher CG is never good for handling, but it could be that a higher CG vehicle (and also taller sidewalls) simply accentuates one of the trade offs of snow tires... "squirreliness".
I have WS70's with 18" wheels on the Q5 and I have definitely noticed more of this trade off than I ever had with the A3. It is especially noticeable in a strong cross wind. Even on dry roads, I have to make frequent steering corrections to keep a straight line and it is easy to over correct. However, during the few snowfalls we have had, the snow traction has been awesome even though I still sense and have to correct for the "squirrelies". It's a trade off. If I had chosen a performance winter tire and/or larger diameter wheels, I'm sure I would not need to pay as much attention to steering input but I would have reduced traction. In one way, the "squirrelies" is a good thing because I always have to keep my mind on my driving... though it does have me second-guessing whether I should have purchased the DM-V1's instead.
I have WS70's with 18" wheels on the Q5 and I have definitely noticed more of this trade off than I ever had with the A3. It is especially noticeable in a strong cross wind. Even on dry roads, I have to make frequent steering corrections to keep a straight line and it is easy to over correct. However, during the few snowfalls we have had, the snow traction has been awesome even though I still sense and have to correct for the "squirrelies". It's a trade off. If I had chosen a performance winter tire and/or larger diameter wheels, I'm sure I would not need to pay as much attention to steering input but I would have reduced traction. In one way, the "squirrelies" is a good thing because I always have to keep my mind on my driving... though it does have me second-guessing whether I should have purchased the DM-V1's instead.
I would just like to mention here I purchased Bridgestone Turanza LS A/S tires for my past A4. I was coming off Michelin MXM4's which steered and handled perfectly. The Turanza's wandered, needing constant corrections. The dealer aligned, and aligned, and aligned, including loosening the sub frame and aligning that also. The Turanza's still wandered. I pulled them at 5K miles as I had enough. Put on the Conti's 3 years ago and no wandering. The Conti's wore out this past March. I was in the process of buying a Q5, so I grabbed the Turanza's lying around and put them on the A4. Guess what no wandering! All I can think of was that the rubber aged for 3 years and became a stiffer sidewall. They really handled and rode extremely well.
12-15-2013, 07:38 AM
#22
AudiWorld Expert
Thanks. I'll read. Bottom line though is it makes me nervous in the snow.
As an aside, I don't love the CVT in the Subaru. It sounds and feels like it is always in a low gear. Having said that, I have never driven in a more stable car in the snow than the outback. I was driving my Audi in a very slippery snow the other day with cars sliding all over the place. I am an experienced snow driver but the Audi was having trouble maneuvering. I got stuck on a couple hills where someone in front had spun out and I had to stop. I couldn't get going again and did a lot of sliding sideways when trying to reposition myself.
Meanwhile, my wife, not a great snow driver was behind me in the outback. She was driving like it was wet pavement. No sliding whatsoever. After we finally made it home, I got in the outback and took it for a short drive. The stability was spectacular. I find the Audi to be fairly good in the snow. The problems I had the other day were because the snow was extremely slippery.... but the Outback outclasses the Audi and every other car I've ever driven by far. Again, not near as fun to drive normally...but give it to me in the snow. The difference was not just the transmission, it seemed to be the stance on the road or whatever the factors are that keep traction. I have manufacturer's tires on both and the subi's tires are a bit newer...but even when new, my audi and volvo have never held the road like this.
As an aside, I don't love the CVT in the Subaru. It sounds and feels like it is always in a low gear. Having said that, I have never driven in a more stable car in the snow than the outback. I was driving my Audi in a very slippery snow the other day with cars sliding all over the place. I am an experienced snow driver but the Audi was having trouble maneuvering. I got stuck on a couple hills where someone in front had spun out and I had to stop. I couldn't get going again and did a lot of sliding sideways when trying to reposition myself.
Meanwhile, my wife, not a great snow driver was behind me in the outback. She was driving like it was wet pavement. No sliding whatsoever. After we finally made it home, I got in the outback and took it for a short drive. The stability was spectacular. I find the Audi to be fairly good in the snow. The problems I had the other day were because the snow was extremely slippery.... but the Outback outclasses the Audi and every other car I've ever driven by far. Again, not near as fun to drive normally...but give it to me in the snow. The difference was not just the transmission, it seemed to be the stance on the road or whatever the factors are that keep traction. I have manufacturer's tires on both and the subi's tires are a bit newer...but even when new, my audi and volvo have never held the road like this.
12-15-2013, 11:08 AM
#23
Do not use the gear box manual mode to reduce speed. It does exactly what you quoted and explained by others. You could very easily lose traction through the jerky down-shift.
Use the button that is marked with a car going down-hill to let the car use ESC, ASR, ABS and EBD together with its off-road mode and cruise-control to keep things under control. I have used it very successfully on very steep dirt and snow/ice to slow the car. Using the brakes alone would have caused issues. The function is well described in the manual.
For the record, I used this on both the 2011 2.0T and the 2013 3.0T with great success.
Your tire selection is another huge factor as others have stated.
.
Use the button that is marked with a car going down-hill to let the car use ESC, ASR, ABS and EBD together with its off-road mode and cruise-control to keep things under control. I have used it very successfully on very steep dirt and snow/ice to slow the car. Using the brakes alone would have caused issues. The function is well described in the manual.
For the record, I used this on both the 2011 2.0T and the 2013 3.0T with great success.
Your tire selection is another huge factor as others have stated.
.
Last edited by dsackman; 12-15-2013 at 11:11 AM.
12-16-2013, 06:02 AM
#24
AudiWorld Senior Member
radman: I can't help you on why your Q5 is jerky, but I can tell you my 2.0T feels MUCH more stable in the snow than my Subaru did. It sounds like you just need to drive it in D, not S or M. When you drive it in M, you are probably forcing the car to lose traction. Better to leave it in D and let it do its own thing in the snow.
12-16-2013, 09:50 AM
#25
AudiWorld Super User
Had 8 inches of snow yesterday.....
radman: I can't help you on why your Q5 is jerky, but I can tell you my 2.0T feels MUCH more stable in the snow than my Subaru did. It sounds like you just need to drive it in D, not S or M. When you drive it in M, you are probably forcing the car to lose traction. Better to leave it in D and let it do its own thing in the snow.
The bottom line again, is the tall Q is easily shifting weight, wanting to slide/wander during that weight shift. Both vehicles handled just fine in a straight line but we don't always drive in a straight line...........
12-16-2013, 09:55 AM
#26
AudiWorld Senior Member
Took out both Q5 and the Subaru Outback over unplowed roads and the Outback handled the snow soooo well I'll nickname it the Porsche, the Q felt very unstable compared to the Outback, I'll nickname the Q, Kia. There is no way that one could follow the Outback with the Q at speed on these roads, the Outback will leave the Q in the dust(snow).
The bottom line again, is the tall Q is easily shifting weight, wanting to slide/wander during that weight shift. Both vehicles handled just fine in a straight line but we don't always drive in a straight line...........
The bottom line again, is the tall Q is easily shifting weight, wanting to slide/wander during that weight shift. Both vehicles handled just fine in a straight line but we don't always drive in a straight line...........
EDIT: My Honda Ridgeline is a better overall performer in snow and ice than either the Audi or Subie (and possibly better than any other passenger vehicle) because it has the ground clearance of a truck and also has independent rear suspension, traction control, and real-time 4WD of a car/crossover, but I'm getting off topic now and just bragging.
Last edited by Parsec; 12-16-2013 at 10:01 AM.
12-16-2013, 10:28 AM
#27
AudiWorld Senior Member
radman: I can't help you on why your Q5 is jerky, but I can tell you my 2.0T feels MUCH more stable in the snow than my Subaru did. It sounds like you just need to drive it in D, not S or M. When you drive it in M, you are probably forcing the car to lose traction. Better to leave it in D and let it do its own thing in the snow.
12-16-2013, 12:48 PM
#28
Audiworld Junior Member
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 26
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Bob--same tires on Q5 and OB? I'm coming from an OB 3.6R and Michelin XIce2's (have a 3.0 and XIce3's) and was playing around yesterday in our new foot or so of snow. I think the bigger difference is how quickly the Q puts the power to the wheels. If you tread lightly there was not a huge difference, but if you put your foot down--the Q slips more easily, but the traction control seems to do a better job handling slides and helping to straighten things out than on the Outback.
12-16-2013, 06:04 PM
#29
AudiWorld Super User
Bob--same tires on Q5 and OB? I'm coming from an OB 3.6R and Michelin XIce2's (have a 3.0 and XIce3's) and was playing around yesterday in our new foot or so of snow. I think the bigger difference is how quickly the Q puts the power to the wheels. If you tread lightly there was not a huge difference, but if you put your foot down--the Q slips more easily, but the traction control seems to do a better job handling slides and helping to straighten things out than on the Outback.
Yes if I baby the Q it is fine, but I'm a sort of fast driver even in the snow. The OB with the lower center of gravity just has maybe a better seat of the pants feel for what is going on with sliding and easier to correct. It was the same with my previous A4's, they were similar to the OB. I'm stating to think that maybe I should look at the Allroad. The Q5 was bought in June and only has 2K miles on it. I asked the family why it isn't driven more and they said it's not as much fun as the A4, and the OB is more fun now. They also don't like the large outside mirrors and the 8 speed always up/down shifting a lot (the A4's were manual trans).
12-17-2013, 08:45 AM
#30
AudiWorld Member
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: NW Burbs of Chicago
Posts: 443
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
With ESC "off", the Q5 is a little more manageable, but I have to say, between traction control and Stability control hammering individual wheels, it can be unnerving.