Manual shifting is jerky - lurches when I downshift
12-14-2013, 08:47 AM
#11
AudiWorld Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 170
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
How wide are the Q5 tires compared to the scuby?
My guess is a lot wider!
I presume it goes without saying all your cars are on proper winter tires...?
The CVT will help because as you say it can keep the engine always in a low rev range so you can control the torque to the wheels and reduce the chance of a spin.
Also, there will be differences in the 4x4 systems (assuming your other 2 have it?)... Quattro is not really designed for off road use IMO, more better on road handling.
My guess is a lot wider!
I presume it goes without saying all your cars are on proper winter tires...?
The CVT will help because as you say it can keep the engine always in a low rev range so you can control the torque to the wheels and reduce the chance of a spin.
Also, there will be differences in the 4x4 systems (assuming your other 2 have it?)... Quattro is not really designed for off road use IMO, more better on road handling.
All driving is on road...but I'm talking about snow driving.
Not sure of size wheels. Wouldn't wider tires be more stable?
The Audi drive is much nimbler and sophisticated on dry and wet roads than the subi. I do find that it shifts awkwardly sometimes... for example, when I am about to stop, it will downshift suddenly and the car lurches. With 8 gears, I think it has trouble choosing sometimes.
12-14-2013, 10:03 AM
#12
AudiWorld Member
I mean it's designed for dry roads, not snowy/icy roads...
The lurchy downshift at almost stop is also due to lockup clutch. It's has its merits RE efficiency as I say, but it could be made a bit softer in certain situations I agree.
You want narrow tyres so they put more weight in a smaller patch to drive the snow out from under the tyre and get you down to the black stuff. Wider tyres make you skate on top of the snow/icy.
The lurchy downshift at almost stop is also due to lockup clutch. It's has its merits RE efficiency as I say, but it could be made a bit softer in certain situations I agree.
You want narrow tyres so they put more weight in a smaller patch to drive the snow out from under the tyre and get you down to the black stuff. Wider tyres make you skate on top of the snow/icy.
12-14-2013, 10:07 AM
#13
AudiWorld Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 170
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I mean it's designed for dry roads, not snowy/icy roads...
The lurchy downshift at almost stop is also due to lockup clutch. It's has its merits RE efficiency as I say, but it could be made a bit softer in certain situations I agree.
You want narrow tyres so they put more weight in a smaller patch to drive the snow out from under the tyre and get you down to the black stuff. Wider tyres make you skate on top of the snow/icy.
The lurchy downshift at almost stop is also due to lockup clutch. It's has its merits RE efficiency as I say, but it could be made a bit softer in certain situations I agree.
You want narrow tyres so they put more weight in a smaller patch to drive the snow out from under the tyre and get you down to the black stuff. Wider tyres make you skate on top of the snow/icy.
As for being designed for dry conditions, I don't get that. If you mean the car itself...it is designed for wet/snow/dry. The all wheel drive in particular is for wet and snow conditions since this isn't an offroad vehicle. Audi makes a big deal out of its performance in the snow and rain when it advertises.
If you mean the tiptronic...I don't get that either. Shifting with it in dry conditions is just for fun. If you really wanted to shift, you would get an manual transmission car. However, the main reason to use it is to downshift in poor conditions.
It definitely would feel more sure-footed if it didn't "let go" for that brief instant when you downshift...
12-14-2013, 10:20 AM
#14
AudiWorld Member
Quattro on Audi is not like Land Rovers 4x4 system.
It's designed for rallying originally and these days for fun on road driving. If you want to drive on snow/icy roads it's not the best is what I'm saying. Better that FWD but not its forte, other manufacturers like volvo for example make their 4x4 systems for nasty road conditions rather than fast good conditions as Audi do. This is my opinion based on knowing the history of Audi and extensive research on the subject other the years - others may disagree.
It's designed for rallying originally and these days for fun on road driving. If you want to drive on snow/icy roads it's not the best is what I'm saying. Better that FWD but not its forte, other manufacturers like volvo for example make their 4x4 systems for nasty road conditions rather than fast good conditions as Audi do. This is my opinion based on knowing the history of Audi and extensive research on the subject other the years - others may disagree.
12-14-2013, 10:26 AM
#15
AudiWorld Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 170
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Quattro on Audi is not like Land Rovers 4x4 system.
It's designed for rallying originally and these days for fun on road driving. If you want to drive on snow/icy roads it's not the best is what I'm saying. Better that FWD but not its forte, other manufacturers like volvo for example make their 4x4 systems for nasty road conditions rather than fast good conditions as Audi do. This is my opinion based on knowing the history of Audi and extensive research on the subject other the years - others may disagree.
It's designed for rallying originally and these days for fun on road driving. If you want to drive on snow/icy roads it's not the best is what I'm saying. Better that FWD but not its forte, other manufacturers like volvo for example make their 4x4 systems for nasty road conditions rather than fast good conditions as Audi do. This is my opinion based on knowing the history of Audi and extensive research on the subject other the years - others may disagree.
12-14-2013, 11:08 AM
#16
Might be the tires? As was previously pointed out, width makes a difference. Also, my '11 CPO came with Michelin Latitude Tour HPs, which according to Tire Rack are excellent for dry traction (rated 8.9) but mediocre in deep snow and ice, respectively (5.9 and 5.9). Fortunately I live in the San Francisco Peninsula where we never get snow and rarely, ice. We head to the mountains about 4x a year and always pray for dry conditions!
12-14-2013, 11:28 AM
#17
AudiWorld Super User
I agree with the Q5 and Outback......
Thanks. I'll read. Bottom line though is it makes me nervous in the snow.
As an aside, I don't love the CVT in the Subaru. It sounds and feels like it is always in a low gear. Having said that, I have never driven in a more stable car in the snow than the outback. I was driving my Audi in a very slippery snow the other day with cars sliding all over the place. I am an experienced snow driver but the Audi was having trouble maneuvering. I got stuck on a couple hills where someone in front had spun out and I had to stop. I couldn't get going again and did a lot of sliding sideways when trying to reposition myself.
Meanwhile, my wife, not a great snow driver was behind me in the outback. She was driving like it was wet pavement. No sliding whatsoever. After we finally made it home, I got in the outback and took it for a short drive. The stability was spectacular. I find the Audi to be fairly good in the snow. The problems I had the other day were because the snow was extremely slippery.... but the Outback outclasses the Audi and every other car I've ever driven by far. Again, not near as fun to drive normally...but give it to me in the snow. The difference was not just the transmission, it seemed to be the stance on the road or whatever the factors are that keep traction. I have manufacturer's tires on both and the subi's tires are a bit newer...but even when new, my audi and volvo have never held the road like this.
As an aside, I don't love the CVT in the Subaru. It sounds and feels like it is always in a low gear. Having said that, I have never driven in a more stable car in the snow than the outback. I was driving my Audi in a very slippery snow the other day with cars sliding all over the place. I am an experienced snow driver but the Audi was having trouble maneuvering. I got stuck on a couple hills where someone in front had spun out and I had to stop. I couldn't get going again and did a lot of sliding sideways when trying to reposition myself.
Meanwhile, my wife, not a great snow driver was behind me in the outback. She was driving like it was wet pavement. No sliding whatsoever. After we finally made it home, I got in the outback and took it for a short drive. The stability was spectacular. I find the Audi to be fairly good in the snow. The problems I had the other day were because the snow was extremely slippery.... but the Outback outclasses the Audi and every other car I've ever driven by far. Again, not near as fun to drive normally...but give it to me in the snow. The difference was not just the transmission, it seemed to be the stance on the road or whatever the factors are that keep traction. I have manufacturer's tires on both and the subi's tires are a bit newer...but even when new, my audi and volvo have never held the road like this.
12-14-2013, 12:11 PM
#18
A heavier vehicle will move thru snow (straight line) better than a lighter vehicle, all else being equal. Of course, if you make some poor steering decisions, the heavier vehicle will get you in trouble faster too.
You simply can't make a valid comparison of traction between one vehicle and another unless you are using identical tires with the same amount of wear. A good set of snow tires makes a huge difference on any vehicle and all season tires can vary from awful in snow to nearly as good as some snow tires. I've had RWD, FWD, and AWD vehicles with all sorts of tires. For winter driving, I would take a modern FWD car with a good set of snow tires over any AWD vehicle with all season tires. My FWD A3 with snow tires tracked much better in snow than my previous BMW 330xi with all season tires.
And I should add that I've lived in Wisconsin most of my life. My first car was a 5.0 Mustang... now that was a bad car in snow, even with snow tires.
You simply can't make a valid comparison of traction between one vehicle and another unless you are using identical tires with the same amount of wear. A good set of snow tires makes a huge difference on any vehicle and all season tires can vary from awful in snow to nearly as good as some snow tires. I've had RWD, FWD, and AWD vehicles with all sorts of tires. For winter driving, I would take a modern FWD car with a good set of snow tires over any AWD vehicle with all season tires. My FWD A3 with snow tires tracked much better in snow than my previous BMW 330xi with all season tires.
And I should add that I've lived in Wisconsin most of my life. My first car was a 5.0 Mustang... now that was a bad car in snow, even with snow tires.
Last edited by stash64; 12-14-2013 at 12:13 PM.
12-14-2013, 02:23 PM
#19
AudiWorld Super User
A heavier vehicle will move thru snow (straight line) better than a lighter vehicle, all else being equal. Of course, if you make some poor steering decisions, the heavier vehicle will get you in trouble faster too.
You simply can't make a valid comparison of traction between one vehicle and another unless you are using identical tires with the same amount of wear. A good set of snow tires makes a huge difference on any vehicle and all season tires can vary from awful in snow to nearly as good as some snow tires. I've had RWD, FWD, and AWD vehicles with all sorts of tires. For winter driving, I would take a modern FWD car with a good set of snow tires over any AWD vehicle with all season tires. My FWD A3 with snow tires tracked much better in snow than my previous BMW 330xi with all season tires.
And I should add that I've lived in Wisconsin most of my life. My first car was a 5.0 Mustang... now that was a bad car in snow, even with snow tires.
You simply can't make a valid comparison of traction between one vehicle and another unless you are using identical tires with the same amount of wear. A good set of snow tires makes a huge difference on any vehicle and all season tires can vary from awful in snow to nearly as good as some snow tires. I've had RWD, FWD, and AWD vehicles with all sorts of tires. For winter driving, I would take a modern FWD car with a good set of snow tires over any AWD vehicle with all season tires. My FWD A3 with snow tires tracked much better in snow than my previous BMW 330xi with all season tires.
And I should add that I've lived in Wisconsin most of my life. My first car was a 5.0 Mustang... now that was a bad car in snow, even with snow tires.
The Q doesn't handle fast turns at speed as well in the dry compared to the A4, so the Q is going to handle with the same differences in the snow.
12-14-2013, 06:43 PM
#20
I do agree that higher CG is never good for handling, but it could be that a higher CG vehicle (and also taller sidewalls) simply accentuates one of the trade offs of snow tires... "squirreliness".
I have WS70's with 18" wheels on the Q5 and I have definitely noticed more of this trade off than I ever had with the A3. It is especially noticeable in a strong cross wind. Even on dry roads, I have to make frequent steering corrections to keep a straight line and it is easy to over correct. However, during the few snowfalls we have had, the snow traction has been awesome even though I still sense and have to correct for the "squirrelies". It's a trade off. If I had chosen a performance winter tire and/or larger diameter wheels, I'm sure I would not need to pay as much attention to steering input but I would have reduced traction. In one way, the "squirrelies" is a good thing because I always have to keep my mind on my driving... though it does have me second-guessing whether I should have purchased the DM-V1's instead.
I have WS70's with 18" wheels on the Q5 and I have definitely noticed more of this trade off than I ever had with the A3. It is especially noticeable in a strong cross wind. Even on dry roads, I have to make frequent steering corrections to keep a straight line and it is easy to over correct. However, during the few snowfalls we have had, the snow traction has been awesome even though I still sense and have to correct for the "squirrelies". It's a trade off. If I had chosen a performance winter tire and/or larger diameter wheels, I'm sure I would not need to pay as much attention to steering input but I would have reduced traction. In one way, the "squirrelies" is a good thing because I always have to keep my mind on my driving... though it does have me second-guessing whether I should have purchased the DM-V1's instead.
