Go Back   AudiWorld Forums » Audi Models » Other Audi » Audi 5000 / 200 / V8 Discussion
Sign in using an external account
Register Forgot Password?

Welcome to AudiWorld!
Welcome to AudiWorld.com.

You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community, at no cost, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is free, fast and simple, join AudiWorld.com today!


Discussion Forums:
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 03-24-2006, 03:12 PM   #11
Audiworld Junior Member
Garage is empty, add now
Join Date: Oct 2000
Posts: 61
Default What exactly would you do with a 6th injector?

nowers is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-24-2006, 04:53 PM   #12
AudiWorld Super User
Garage is empty, add now
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 5,485
Default You want me to type a book? Ok... get your beer goggles on!

Start with identifying the basic parts under your hood. Motor? I'm sure you have that one figured out. Now it needs 2 things to make bangs and go varoom. Gas and spark followed by sucessive suck, squeeze, bang, blow. The spark comes via the distributor as you may already know as well... except, this is an Audi. For spark to happen you need a few things to happen. First the starter needs to turn the motor over. then, there are a couple of sensors that must work before the computer (ECU) will send a signal to the coil to make a spark. the distributor contains a hall sensor that sends the ECU a signal saying, "Hey we should be firing any time now". The ECU says sure, but I want to know where a reference to TDC (Top Dead Centre) is first and looks for another signal from the Crank position reference sensor. Without both signals there will be no reliable spark (occasionally the seed value in the ECU is close enough that the guess leads to a spark, at least that's my guess because I have started cars with no crank sensor - but don't count on it!) So, now there is the spark, and believe me that is the easy part.

The other half of that equation is the gas. Being a fuel injected motor you can deduce that is the reason behind those nice braided lines all over the motor. Yep. Fuel lines. Notice that they all lead back to a unit on the passenger side of the engine bay. that is the C.I.S. fuel distributor. It is a mechanical system that is VERY robust and reliable. that being said, once things get thrown out of whack it can be a bear to troubleshoot. So, lets just leave that as a squirty thing that gives the motor fuel when it needs it. The amoutn of fuel is controlled by a sensor plate that 'floats' in the air stream under that igloo loooking thing next to the fuel distributor. the higher it rises the more fuel is added.

Familiar with a turbo yet? Know this. The WG (waste gate) does exactly what it sounds like it does... wastes stuff. It allows exhaust gasses another path to bypass the turbo and limit how much the turbo spools up and thus how much boost it can deliver. Without one your turbo will boost your motor into little sharp and hot bits of metal.

So, you want more power...

Stop the WG for wating so much exhaust gas and make the turbo jam more air into the motor. Make sure you have neough fuel to match the air you are stuffing in. You want something like 12.5:1 for peak power Air fuel ratio. Make sure the ECU knows what to do with the spark when there is all that extra air... ah ha! This is where your chip comes in. QLCC stands for the Quattro List Chip Club. A group of enthusiasts got together and tore apart the factory code to see if they could improve on things. Boy did they ever. They raised the stock boost level from 1.4 to 1.8 bar absolute (absolute air pressure uses 1.0 as 1 atmosphere of pressure (no boost and no vac). When you turn the key to the ON position the boost gauge on the dash should show 0.9 to 1.0 depending on your location.

Where am I know... I need a scotch...

Ahhhh.... that's better...

OK... so, the QLCC code is floating about. Burn your own chip and it's inexpensive. Get someone with the gear and know-how to do it and you'll pay a little for it (still cheap by any measure of hp gain per $). Now the ECU can handle the higher boost when it sees it. Put a stiffer spring under the WG cap to keep it from opening so soon and you get more oomph from the turbo.

But, as usually happens, and happened to me, 1.8 bar becomes boring quickly. One starts to think "What would happen if I..."

Tthis lead me to want more boost. But then the ECU needs some more tweaking, as does the WG. Then there is the question of fuel. At WOT and big boost you need a load more fuel. "Ta-DA!... 6th injector. Triggered by a pressure switch that senses when the extra fuel is required it dumps fuel into the air stream and keeps the motor from running lean and knocking.

That is a load of information. Digest and read it over. Search for more information on each topic within the forum. It is ALL here. In fact... allow me to add to your reading enjoyment...

The following text is from research done over a few years... Thanks to their respective authors:



Here is some history behind the QLCC ECU chip mods that RDH started on
the MAC-02 ur-Quattro back in the Fall of 1995. RDH has a web page with
more details on the MAC-02 code he developed. Go to
http://www.tiac.net/users/rdh/http/ for more info.

Many people on the qlist were discussing ECU mods and raising the boost
on the Audis, people began looking inside their stock and modified ECU's and discussed which tuner did this, and which tuner did that, resistor mods, fuel pump hard wiring, zener diode mods etc. were discussed. Paul Timmerman of Schrapnel Knobbin fame was also involved in these discussions about raising the boost on the Audi ur-Quattros and on the 5000TQ.

RDH posted some detailed information on the manifold pressure map values from the MAC-02 ECU code on Dec. 12th 1995 which caught my eye. Dave Lawson had been in contact with RDH during this same period and knew RDH from a previous meeting. RDH developed the software code that would dis-assemble the EPROM code Hexidecimal values from the MAC-02 ECU and match these against the MAC-02 micro-processor (uP) instruction codes or operation codes (op codes).

The EPROM in the ECU contains both data and the actual instructions in a Hexidecimal format (base 16). The actual uP instructions are used to
monitor the engine parameters and then set the timing and fuel (frequency valve duty cycle), monitor engine component operation and
issue fault codes etc. RDH spent many hours, (days/months?) reverse
engineering the data (Maps) portion of the code along with the actual uP instructions. RDH sent me the disassembled listing he had for the MAC-02 code around May 10, 1995 and after doing a quick look and comparison to the MAC11 ECU code (1986-88 5000TQ), I was able to locate the regular and premium timing maps in the MAC11 code. The Audi Factory Service "1986 new Model information" that I had, shows the MAC11 timing map graph, so finding the timing map values was pretty easy. The timing map values are the first 32 lines of the code in the EPROM and this is where the MAC-02 had its timing map as well.

I posted a note the quattro list indicating that I located this timing
info. Dave Lawson had also been working on the MAC11 code previously
and after seeing my post to the qlist, indicated he had also noticed the timing maps and had some other suggestions for some of the other code locations. Steve Eiche became interested at this same time and had been doing some of his own investigation, Graydon, Scott J. and others became intersted in the code findings as well. On 5/28/96 I announced to the qlist that I found the overboost fuel pump cutout map. I did this by graphically comparing the MAC11 code to the MAC-02 code which also used this overboost fuel pump cutout feature.

Now it was possible to change the overboost cutout map values and allow
running boost above the stock 1.6 bar cutout value,using the stock ECU
pressure sensor this overboost cutout could be set up to ~1.95 bar
before the fuel pump cut out would occur.

During this same time, RDH had sent me the software code for doing the
actual disassembly of the MAC-02 code and I believe Dave Lawson had also begun working with RDH's code to run on his PC. (Dave Lawson, please add any details or corrections where needed). With RDH's help and patience, I was able to get this program to run on my Unix mainframe at work. Unfortunately, not being a software programmer by trade (Electrical Engineering is my bag), I was unable to make much progress modify RDH's program to correctly work with the MAC11 code and accomplish the disassembly process.

At some point, (Orin help me here) I believe that I sent a copy of RDH's program to Orin up in the Seattle area and this is where the real
progress began on the MAC11 code. Orin modified the RDH program and
began reverse engineering the MAC11 code. Orin located the actual "boost maps" that the ECU uses along with the Waste Gate Solenoid to
dynamically adjust the boost above what the Waste Gate Spring pressure
can provide.

During this time, I provided some Audi technical information which
helped Orin and others with the deciphering process and I also started
doing some on car testing to understand how the map values corresponded
with actual engine parameters. Other people on the qlist got involved at the same time and were doing there own work on the code as more and more information became available.

The important thing to note, is that this information was freely spread
between 5-6 people who were investigating how the MAC11 ECU worked and
had the hardware or software knowledge to futher this investigation.
Dave Lawson worked with Scott J. on correlating the K26 Turbo
characteristics and investigated the disassembled listing of the MAC11
code to come up with a modified version of the MAC-ll to work well with this K26 output profile. I was working on the later MAC14 code
modifications at the same time to make my 1989 200TQ with the dual knock sensor engine run better and better. I believe Dave Lawsons version of the MAC11 code was spread out amongst several other QLCC list members who agreed to do some low cost EPROM upgrades, Steve Eiche, Dave Lawson, Graydon Stuckey, David Kavanaugh, Steve Buchholz are a few of the people who began offering this service as well as the service I was providing using my own version of code. In some cases each person made changes to the QLCC code as they did more testing. (If I left anyone off this list, please correct me)

The QLCC name "Quattro List Chip Club" I believe was coined by Steve
Buchholz after I jokingly suggested we put together some sort of chip
club like the "Hair club for Men"

Well, after going through my notes and old email posts that I have, that is how I remember this QLCC thing happening. Other thoughts, with
additions or corrections are most welcomed from other members in this

Happy code crunching!
Scott Mo.
1989 200TQ

The important thing to note, is that this information was freely spread
between 5-6 people who were investigating how the MAC11 ECU worked and
had the hardware or software knowledge to futher this investigation.

All very well, but it doesn't explain how useful the QLCC has been to us over here in Europe.

The MB engine fitted to the 1988/9 ur-quattro is essentially a hybrid of the MC-1 and MC-2. Audi didn't build very many, and documented the engine management system _very_ poorly indeed. I started into this business not from a point of wanting things to go better - but from wanting to know how to tell when they weren't going as well as they should.

Scott Mockry said one day that he might be able to help - if he could see the MAC12D's code. I went down to the local scrappers, picked up a MAC12D (perhaps the only spare in the country at the time) for $300 and mailed it off to Scott.

Out of the goodness of his heart and pure charity, Scott took the ROM chip out, put in a socket, dumped the ROM, burnt an EPROM, and sent the lot back. Some little while later, an email of the disassembled source code arrived.

The MAC12D is nothing more than a MAC11 with the emission controls code fairly crudely removed and a few values changed for the ur-quattro implementation.

At present, our side of the project is stalled because:

a) My car has been in the bodyshop for 8 weeks and I can't experiment


b) I don't have a portable and accurate a/f meter.

We have, though, learned a great deal from Scott's and Orin's input over here. We have managed to explain very convincingly why MB engines are very hard to tweak with satisfactory results. Some of the experts (e.g., Martin at BR Motorsport) already knew this from practical experience, and we've managed to account for the phenomena they observed. The timing and boost maps explain some performance flat spots (one especially) that _should_ prove fairly easy to fix. We have yet to crack the fuel frequency valve, but we're making progress.

If it hadn't been for the QLCC, I would _never_ (in a month of Sundays) have worked out how the MB's fuel injection system works. I've been sharing the knowledge at club meetings, carrying fuel pressure meters and Scott's wonderful WGFV test light. Without the QLCC, a whole raft of UK MB owners (John Scott, Tony Hill, me, Terry Gee) would still be driving round with sick cars.

Phil Payne
UK Audi [ur-]quattro Owners Club

I'm posting the mods to the standard Mac-11C code from my car. I think
it works with Mac11B and Mac14 ECUs as well.

This is the readme file I keep with my other files to help me keep things straight. I've been running what is called 1.2 since September '97. It is not clear to me that the increased duty cycle at WOT is necessary (or doing any good), but I felt that a little rich is better. When I get off my but and monitor the O2 sensor, I'll get a better feel for mixture. (Or I could use that thermocouple meter I have to monitor exhaust temp like the big boys do!)


PS. I have some other useful info that I started with from Scott M and Orin, but they didn't sent it to the list, so I won't (unless they are OK with it).


Mac11-C modifications:

audi.* = original code
code as dumped from prom.

================================================== =====================

audi10.* = version 1.0 modifications (11/96)
1. modified boost fuel cutoff curve (raised limit to near 1.95 bar).
2. modified desired boost curve (so wastegate will help us get there).
3. modified wastegate modulation based on RPM.

Diffs between original and version 1.0:

diff audi.asm audi10.asm

audi20.* = version 2.0 modifications (Under development)
1. increased boost fuel cuttoff to actual 1.95 bar.
2. increased O2 duty cycle for WOT
3. increased desired boost curve so max is 1.90 bar from <3770 - 5180 RPM.

version 1.1 contains 1, 3
version 1.2 contains 1, 2, 3

Diffs between version 1.0 and 2.0:

Diff audi10.asm audi20.asm


And then there is my own mess:

As promised this is my report on how to turn your MC1 equipped Audi 5000 or 200 into a FrankenAudi. First I think it best to outline my project goals. Put simply, I want to squeeze as much power from the I5 engine as possible for the lowest dollar. Please keep in mind that the driving force here is LOW COST. I don't want to hear that I could have done this or could have done that. I know I could have. I chose not to and decided on this method. You are free to believe what you like just as I am free to save a buck or several thousand. As many of you already know the largest obstacle impeding the path to higher boost is the fueling limitations of the CIS system. Right from the start I ruled that EFI conversion was too expensive for such a beater as my dear ol' FrankenAudi so I had to stick with CIS. Where to get more fuel? I'll cover that later. What follows is a summary of the modifications done.


First off I found a copy of the QLCC code on the internet, downloaded it and burned a chip. Since I had nothing to do with the chip and it's development I ask you to conduct your own search or purchase a chip from one of the many sources out there. If you take the time to find the code and burn the chip yourself the cost will only be a couple of dollars.

To assist the QLCC code a 1.8 or 1.9 bar spring is recommended by many people so I ordered one of those and some straps to keep the intercooler together as well. I think that cost about $60 from one of those reputable suppliers.

Well, that was just great. The car ran very nicely and had substantially more power than where it started. Just not enough power. Where to get more power...

Back to that fuel system limitation I mentioned at the start. Thanks to input from various sources I discovered that the control pressure on the CIS is developed with a spring mounted into the base of the CIS distributor at the same level as the incoming fuel supply line. Shimming the plunger in there adds more pressure to the system. A quick visit to the wrecker and those shims are not hard to find. I added about 1mm and the additional pressure made a HUGE difference as measured by the old seat-o-the-pants accelerometer. In order to notice with that measurement device the difference must be substantial.

At this point I decided to build my own narrow-band A/F meter that runs off the factory O2 sensor line at the ECU. The fuel was good and strong all the way to 1.95 bar (I hit the fuel cut out several times). OK, so far so good. The net expense is under $70 and the power and fuel are in good shape up to about 14 psi of boost.

Here is my Dr. Frankenstein plan:

1) Modify the waste gate cap with an M12 x 1.25 thread pitch bolt with about a 55 to 70 mm length. I used 55mm. There are issues here. You will not find a bolt that is threaded all the way up to the head so you will need an M12 x 1.25 t.p. die to thread your bolt all the way. Also, the nuts available are far too thick and need to be cut in half. I used a Dremel style tool for the job. Remove the spring perch, punch out the cap, place the thin (cut) nut on the bolt, insert the bolt into the WG cap, weld the perch to the bolt, and... Voila! You are done. Now you can adjust the spring pressure from 1.8 bar to clamped shut. Details about this mod are also available elsewhere so I won't steal their thunder. Adjustable WG cap installed - vary boost pressure above 1.8 bar. Mission accomplished, but now I simply slam the fuel cut out as one would expect. Cost here is the bolt and nut. I got mine for free but let's just say they cost $2. You should be able to find a friend with a tap and die set for the threads.

2) This scheme didn't work out but since it is all knowledge it is useful and should be shared. I decided to try and implement a couple of pressure switches to bypass the ECUs fuel cut out and trigger a 6th fuel injector. Be very careful with this idea. I blew 2 chipped ECUs testing this method.

The fuel pump relay has two sets of outputs. One supplies power to the fuel pump, the other to the fuel frequency valve and other OXS system components. Originally I had only the fuel pump side bypassed. The fuel pump kept pumping but the ECU tried to shut down all the other OXS gear and the car would ping heavily. Unfortunately this is implemented to happen at high boost levels so instantly running very lean is very bad indeed. Once I had the other OXS components fed properly I had already caused the ECUs to fail. At the time I am writing this I do not have enough spare ECUs kicking about to experiment any further. Instead I implemented the Resistor mod using a 3.6 kOhm resistor. Again, this is covered heavily and in great detail elsewhere so the honour isn't mine.

3) The 6th injector mentioned above is also connected to a pressure switch. I have it set to activate at about 1.85 bar. Why? Well, the system ran beautifully up to 1.95 bar and showed good power and fuel mixture. There is no sense adding too much fuel too early. Here I can espouse some knowledge. Many read that I am using a 6th injector and assume that I am using the factory cold start injector location. I am not. The factory CSI location is a bad idea for WOT enrichment. Why? Look at it's location. It is easy to see that with air flow in the intake manifold above idle of very mild throttle most of the fuel is squirted down the runners of cylinders 4 and 5. Cylinders 1, 2, and 3 are left to burn if you try this method. No experimentation required. This is easy to reason.

So where do you put that 6th injector? Well, you need good A/F mixture and from what I have managed to learn NOS conducted a fair bit of research on this and determined that about 6" from the throttle body butterfly is optimum for a uniform A/F mixture when adding fuel to the intake stream. Isn't it interesting that the factory intercooler uses an intake air temperature sensor with exactly the same hole pattern as the cold start injector? Have you ever noticed that flat spot on the intake manifold above the idle adjustment screw? The space big enough to mount the intake air temperature sensor. Somewhere I read that this was in fact a location used by the factory. I wonder what they put in the intercooler?

That was enough for me. But when you get that injector mounted you still need to get it some fuel. As you are well aware if you are reading this Audis have metric everything. There is a supplier in Texas who specializes in Delorean parts that has some nice copper gasket washers for metric fuel fittings on our CIS systems. He also carries a nice big dual banjo bolt.

Examining the connection to the factory CSI - the one you are not going to use for more fuel - you will notice that it is attached to the incoming fuel line from the fuel filter. But we don't want a dual line from the filter. Go the the wrecker and get this fuel line. Then cut the line to the fuel filter off and get it welded closed. Now you can use the dual banjo bolt and gaskets to bolt it on.
Wait a minute! What injector am I going to use? The same people who were quick to slam the factory CSI location also pointed out that the factory CSI does not flow very much fuel. SAAB on the other hand used a CSI that flows twice the amount of fuel and according to some sources is good for at least another 4psi of boost. The best part is that it bolts right up to the factory Audi CSI line you have just pillaged from the wrecker as well.

So where are we at with fuel and boost...

Well... 1.95 bar translates to 13.77 psi of boost. Add 4 psi and we have 17.77 psi. Not too shabby! Considering my mixture was good and rich up to 1.95 bar I expect that I should be able to run higher boost than that before running dangerously lean.

Back to the plan. That 6th injector gets bolted on where the air intake sensor used to be. We still have to relocate that part to the intake manifold. The first thing that should strike you is how rough that location is. Get your file. A nice rough bastard file should do the job. Take your time and hold it steady to get as flat a surface as you can. Carefully measure the location for the sensor and ensure that you leave enough room for the whole thing to sit flush on the intake manifold. Now select the appropriate bit size and drill your intake manifold out to accommodate the sensor. Measure twice and... better make that 3 times. You don't want to replace your intake like you'll have to if you screw up. Drill slowly using grease to trap the drilled out chaff. I sued a Shopvac like unit to suck it all out as I went and placed a damp rag inside to catch any shavings that were able to breach the inner sanctum.

Now you can use the sensor as a template and a punch or scribe to mark the location for drilling and tapping the bolt holes. Mine ended up a bit shallow so I used washers to accommodate my short drill depth. It is up to you what hardware you want to use so you can select your own drill and tap sizes here. I used the factory hardware. D'OH! The harness won't reach. Remember that car you are pillaging at the wrecker? Well pillage it some more. Cut away the harness for the intake sensor leaving you lots of spare wire at the wrecker. Now cut away your harness connector right at the connector to optimize your length. Solder on the pillaged part (which you have of course taken the time to clean up the connections on). You may wish to use some shrink tubing to cover the wires. This provides some added protection against the elements.

This is a big one eh?

OK nearly done. We still need to trigger that injector. Feeling like a Viking yet? Time to pillage once more! A wiring connector with extra lengths of wire for the cold start valve is still required. You will also need some 2 conductor wire from the hardware store to run from the intercooler location to the fire wall. One line goes to ground and the other to one connection of the pressure switch. Were you get your 12 volt supply for the pressure switch is up to you. I tapped into the fuse panel feed.

What are we at now? $72 plus another $5 for the Saab injector. My wrecker let me have the plumbing and connectors for free. That's $77

4) The pressure switch to trigger 6th injector costs about $18 and the total cost now sits at $95. Use a T to tap into the pressure line that feeds the WG solenoid or, as in my case, that same line is fed to the Waste gate cap through a Schrapnel Knobben. This line sees vacuum at idle and boost as supplied by the turbo. If you plumb your boost line directly to your waste gate cap you will find out where the limits of your intake and exhaust system stand... or perhaps how strong your engine is... er um ... was. These pressure switches are adjustable and you can use your diagnostic LED to see where it triggers in relation to your boost gauge.

That's my first draught. Later versions will include part numbers, bolt specs, preferred suppliers and such.

As reported, I managed to hit 25 psi although it did start to audibly ping at that level. There is no discernable problem running to 20 psi, but again that is seat of the pants stuff especially since my ECU issues seem to have fried my A/F meter.

Oh yes... one other thing. I strongly urge you to consider a BPV at this point. I managed to pop a brand new factory MM hose without much effort. I have reinforced a used one with duct tape for now. That allowed me to learn something else. The lowest point of the MM is also the point that will stretch most under boost. It is also the point closest to the exhaust manifold. I'm going to add more duct tape and then cover with aluminum foil for heat reflection.



Here's what I've sofar............................................. ................thx nate

well first off, do you have new injector 0-ring seals? and new injectors possibly?

those 2 are majorly important for low end power....

also tune the cis frequency valve to a dwell of 40, but your not done, the system pressure of 90-95 psi, and adjust the hot control pressure to 50-53 psi instead of the factory 55-60 psi...

then while your at it, with the injectors in LONG NARROW graduated cylinders increase the differential pressure regulators approx one turn each, then balance everything to the lowest flowing cylinder at 5mm lift on the airflow plate... i caution you, improper adjustment of the differential regulators WILL permanently damage the CIS metering unit.... and you will need to replace it.

finally after the balancing and flow regulation adjustments, you need to look at the rest pressure to besure you are not going to be flooding your engine with a rest pressure too high for the injector tips.... the rest pressure should be 30 psi or less, this requires adjustment in either the system pressure or completely changing the system pressure regulator to a diaphram style from the CIS-E cars or the later model CIS audi 200's then again pressure adjustments will need to be done again...

basically this whole process should take over 10 hours to complete, from start to finish... the injectors and 0-rings should run you about 40-50 bux per injector and 20 bux for the 0-rings, and should you find any cracked injector shrouds, they will need to be replaced aswell....

the hoses and regulator from cis-e cars will run you about 100 bux from a wrecker unless he is cheap....

as you can see this isnt something easy and can easily lead to more cost and trouble if you are inexperienced at this sort of thing...

if your switching the car to EFI soon, you can get away with it on stock cis, but at minimum have new seals in there, no vacuum leaks and bump the pressure to 90-95 psi..... you may have hot start problems, especially without new injectors.

things are going alrighty... just about ready to solder in the eprom socket...


yea, thats the rough cut on cis mod's
there are some other modifications that you can do to improve the fuel flow.

in order you should do the following
every step should be followed by a hot running duty cycle adjustment, unless you are doing EVERYTHING at once.
1. complete tune up, fuel filter
2. inspect for vacuum leaks and repair (injector o-rings)
3. replace injectors
4. fuel pressure modifications.
that right there will lend the vehicle to near new running condition, with the fuel pressure boost giving you more headroom at the high power.

5. balance injector flow with diff regulators on each injector outlet

smoother, better fuel economy, and better power, less chance of per cylinder airfuel differences

6. load sensing CIS-E fuel pressure regulator swap, adjust to 90-100psi at idle

greatly improves headroom at high boost situations....

7. change the frequency valve to a larger flowing valve, OR install another of the same frequency valve in parallel and activate with a boost activated switch. use the same signal as the original frequency valve.

Effectively can add 10-20 percent more fuel if everything else is adjusted properly. i have witnessed it myself. HOWEVER it should only engage at a high boost pressure to prevent over fueling... aka, only turn on above 6-10 psi

8. internal CIS metering unit modifications.

self explainatory.

all in all you can acheive a very high flow of fuel from cis with these modifications.... however the time/effort/money used during this could be put forward to EFI and effectivly make your fuel capabilities unlimited. which is why i switched to EFI, instead of me tinkering around every weekend of the summer extracting another 2 percent out of the cis system, i just plug in my laptop and tune for 10 mins...

EFI = gooooooood. plus there is no stinking airflow meter to block your air intake.
k03 this and k04 that, My T4 turbo will kick your ***!


OK... I think that's enough. If you need more information buy a Bentley and start surfin' baby! There is as much to learn about these cars as you can absorb. I'm still learning.



Toronto, Ontario

1983 Ur Quattro. RS2 Replica turbo, Custom 8.5:1 CR Pistons, sleeved block, MC2 cam, micropolished crank, shot-peened rods, 20VT HG, ARP Head Studs, Supertorque T-belt set up, BPV, Dual diaphragmed WG, chipped ECU, D-ported intake runners, 7mm stem Ti valves, aluminum oil pan, rear sway bar, 5-point harness. "Essica"

Current project:
1983 Ur-Quattro Club Rally car. Still needs engine and transmission... and a number of other things. "Adam Bomb"

1987 Coupe GT. 98,000 original kms, tornado red. "Rosie". Sold.
1988 Olympic Edition 5000 CD Turbo Quattro Avant. "Red Devil" - Sold
1993 Audi V8 Quattro 5-speed conversion, IA chip set, short shift kit, full dual exhaust with 911 Turbo cats. "The Blue Meanie" - Sold
1990 Audi V8Q Pearl - Demolished.
1990 Audi V8Q Pearl - Sold
1989 Audi 200Q Black- "FrankenAudi" Alive again! - Deceased - Taken off the road by ERASE (Eliminate Racing Activity on Streets Everywhere) - Sent directly to crusher, do not pass GO, do not collect $200.
1989 Audi 200Q Avant Black - "FrankenVagen" Deceased May 7th, 2006 - Cause of death: Front end removed in collision - Boy in Ford Expedition SUV ran red light doing 70kph.
1989 Audi 200Q Sedan Tornado Red - "Cherry Bomb" Deceased January 19th, 2004 - Cause of death: Rear end collision - Girl on phone in Buick doing 80kph.
boxerfan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-24-2006, 06:03 PM   #13
Junior Member
Garage is empty, add now
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 1,795
Default Re: i'd wanna see numbers of some sort that back that up.....

nope, not $300, and EFI conversion using megasquirt as a fuel controller runs about $1k and is the cheapest way to go. it can be done for less depending on your junkyarding capabilities.

i'll actually be in chicago this weekend, leaving tommorrow mid-day from the twin cities and will be there thru sunday mid day. i doubt i'd have any time to gtg though.
Jeff R.
87 5kTQ DD, too many goodies to list!
88 80 DD the wife's DD
birdmanmt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-25-2006, 07:46 AM   #14
Avant Sport
AudiWorld Senior Member
Garage is empty, add now
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 1,017
Default Wow, I'm spent. Thanks Boxer!!


'04 A4 1.8tq Avant - GIAC/Debadged/Sport All Weather Mats
'89 200tq Avant (Sold)
Avant Sport is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-26-2006, 01:21 PM   #15
Audiworld Junior Member
Garage is empty, add now
Join Date: Oct 2000
Posts: 61
Default Wow! Thanks a million!

nowers is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-26-2007, 01:19 PM   #16
Audiworld Junior Member
Garage is empty, add now
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 18
Default Re: '90 200 Stock (NonQ) OVERBOOST

Bought this car (200K km) a few months ago (from west coast)& love it. Runs well, except hard to start (10 seconds cold or hot). Replaced Fuel P. check valve + Temp. sensor @ # 1 Sp. Plug - no difference. Engine idle somewhat high (no AC 'on') around 1000 - 1200 rpm +/-. May have def. Throttle Sw. (Full open side). Uses more gas than my '87 5000CD with over 330K km.
Just developed Turbo overboost(stock sys.)from 1.2B (elev. 3,400 here) to 1.5 - 1.6B with partial throttle. Would be nice, except for the following problems:
Full throttle from Standing start = engine hickup/loss of power; same power loss at any speed (when passing/full throttle) around 1.4 - 1.6B PLUS harsh noise from front(?) = wastegate dumping(?)I hope and not the trany,etc..
Finaly got a LED tester & dumped stored MAC-14 CODES = 1st pass (1) 2224, (2) 1111, (3) 0000;
Cleared mem (rmvd fuse) = 2nd pass (1) 4444, (2) 1111, (3) 0000; 3rd pass = 2nd results.
Where do we start?
AudiHip is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-26-2007, 01:19 PM
Audi R8

Paid Advertisement

125, 12mm, audi, balance, bit, cherry, connector, drill, extra, fine, pitch, pop, s6, size, tp, wastegate

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Discussion Forums:

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2009 AudiWorld.com Audi Enthusiast Community

Personal Contacts