S4 Noob! Please help me understand this car before buying one!
07-14-2014, 11:49 PM
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S4 Noob! Please help me understand this car before buying one!
Hey guys, I have literally just made an account not too long ago. I've been doing quite a bit of research on the B8 S4's as I'm looking at making one my next vehicle. Anyways, a little back story... Cliffs to make it short 
- Coming from an '05 STI
- STI is getting impractical since I feel like it's more of a race car rather than a daily driven grocery getter
- I'm getting older now and I want the feel like I'm in a comfy luxury vehicle, but be able to giggle like a little school girl when I get on the gas
- Somewhat mechanically inclined, I've done most of the work on my STI (turbo swaps, bolt-ons, suspension upgrades)
- That's really about it
1) Anyways, I keep seeing the brands AWE & APR pop up over and over again. I assume these two companies are the "go to" guys as far as aftermarket support eh? Is there any other online distributors selling aftermarket parts for these cars?
2) This nearly $2K ECU Chip thing, is there anymore info on it? Specifically, do the S4 ECU's allow you to OPEN SOURCE tune it, or do you need this special chip in order to do so?
3) I assume the most common engine performance bolt-ons are intake, downpipes, catback, and pulley upgrade correct? Is there anything else I'm missing that most of you guys looking for speed may be upgrading as well?
4) I've also read on here that there aren't any supercharger upgrades as of yet... But is there any other options to modify the existing S/C? I come from a turbo FI background, so the S/C's are a bit new to me.
5) Does anyone on the board actually have a heavily modded S4?
I know most of those questions are geared towards engine performance upgrades, however, I think I've done enough research on all other aspects of the vehicle that I found answers to. Coming from the Subaru world, there's tons of aftermarket support, and you can pretty much find upgrades to any part of the car(s).
I've looked at a few used low mileage S4's in my area already, and have seen a few that I like. Haven't test driven one yet, but hopefully I'll do that soon. I just want to know what to look for before jumping into the driver seat.
Thanks a bunch guys!
- Coming from an '05 STI
- STI is getting impractical since I feel like it's more of a race car rather than a daily driven grocery getter
- I'm getting older now and I want the feel like I'm in a comfy luxury vehicle, but be able to giggle like a little school girl when I get on the gas
- Somewhat mechanically inclined, I've done most of the work on my STI (turbo swaps, bolt-ons, suspension upgrades)
- That's really about it
1) Anyways, I keep seeing the brands AWE & APR pop up over and over again. I assume these two companies are the "go to" guys as far as aftermarket support eh? Is there any other online distributors selling aftermarket parts for these cars?
2) This nearly $2K ECU Chip thing, is there anymore info on it? Specifically, do the S4 ECU's allow you to OPEN SOURCE tune it, or do you need this special chip in order to do so?
3) I assume the most common engine performance bolt-ons are intake, downpipes, catback, and pulley upgrade correct? Is there anything else I'm missing that most of you guys looking for speed may be upgrading as well?
4) I've also read on here that there aren't any supercharger upgrades as of yet... But is there any other options to modify the existing S/C? I come from a turbo FI background, so the S/C's are a bit new to me.
5) Does anyone on the board actually have a heavily modded S4?
I know most of those questions are geared towards engine performance upgrades, however, I think I've done enough research on all other aspects of the vehicle that I found answers to. Coming from the Subaru world, there's tons of aftermarket support, and you can pretty much find upgrades to any part of the car(s).
I've looked at a few used low mileage S4's in my area already, and have seen a few that I like. Haven't test driven one yet, but hopefully I'll do that soon. I just want to know what to look for before jumping into the driver seat.
Thanks a bunch guys!
07-15-2014, 04:06 AM
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Good choice. I came from 2 WRXs, loved them, but like you I also felt as though I grew out of them. Nothing against them, but they're just abit too 'kid'.
I'll let the group chime in, but here are my two cents.
You named a few companies that make good equipment, and sell pretty much most of the gear you'd really want without getting into a bigger project build. There are others though -- most of which you can find advertising here on the forum.
The ECU tuning I have read about is not open source. That is to say, I have read the ECU is fairly tricky to get into, and therefore knowledge of the programming is limited. I expect in the coming years that will change, but for now I would stick to out of the box tunes. The good news: those tunes can make a HUGE difference with these cars. To the tune of making an S4 really close to an RS4.
Bolt-ons are most common, yes. The thing is...these cars are fairly well tuned off the line. Until an SC upgrade becomes readily available, most power gains aren't going to be substantial. There will always be intakes, exhausts, brakes, suspension, but many projects (for most, not all) stop there.
There are a few guys on here that have fairly built S4s, and can speak to the topic better than me. What I can say though is that you'll LOVE the car. A perfect blend of cosmopolitan and performance. Plus you won't get every jackass next to you egging you on to race like you're Paul Walker...
Enjoy!
I'll let the group chime in, but here are my two cents.
You named a few companies that make good equipment, and sell pretty much most of the gear you'd really want without getting into a bigger project build. There are others though -- most of which you can find advertising here on the forum.
The ECU tuning I have read about is not open source. That is to say, I have read the ECU is fairly tricky to get into, and therefore knowledge of the programming is limited. I expect in the coming years that will change, but for now I would stick to out of the box tunes. The good news: those tunes can make a HUGE difference with these cars. To the tune of making an S4 really close to an RS4.
Bolt-ons are most common, yes. The thing is...these cars are fairly well tuned off the line. Until an SC upgrade becomes readily available, most power gains aren't going to be substantial. There will always be intakes, exhausts, brakes, suspension, but many projects (for most, not all) stop there.
There are a few guys on here that have fairly built S4s, and can speak to the topic better than me. What I can say though is that you'll LOVE the car. A perfect blend of cosmopolitan and performance. Plus you won't get every jackass next to you egging you on to race like you're Paul Walker...
Enjoy!
Hey guys, I have literally just made an account not too long ago. I've been doing quite a bit of research on the B8 S4's as I'm looking at making one my next vehicle. Anyways, a little back story... Cliffs to make it short
- Coming from an '05 STI
- STI is getting impractical since I feel like it's more of a race car rather than a daily driven grocery getter
- I'm getting older now and I want the feel like I'm in a comfy luxury vehicle, but be able to giggle like a little school girl when I get on the gas
- Somewhat mechanically inclined, I've done most of the work on my STI (turbo swaps, bolt-ons, suspension upgrades)
- That's really about it
1) Anyways, I keep seeing the brands AWE & APR pop up over and over again. I assume these two companies are the "go to" guys as far as aftermarket support eh? Is there any other online distributors selling aftermarket parts for these cars?
2) This nearly $2K ECU Chip thing, is there anymore info on it? Specifically, do the S4 ECU's allow you to OPEN SOURCE tune it, or do you need this special chip in order to do so?
3) I assume the most common engine performance bolt-ons are intake, downpipes, catback, and pulley upgrade correct? Is there anything else I'm missing that most of you guys looking for speed may be upgrading as well?
4) I've also read on here that there aren't any supercharger upgrades as of yet... But is there any other options to modify the existing S/C? I come from a turbo FI background, so the S/C's are a bit new to me.
5) Does anyone on the board actually have a heavily modded S4?
I know most of those questions are geared towards engine performance upgrades, however, I think I've done enough research on all other aspects of the vehicle that I found answers to. Coming from the Subaru world, there's tons of aftermarket support, and you can pretty much find upgrades to any part of the car(s).
I've looked at a few used low mileage S4's in my area already, and have seen a few that I like. Haven't test driven one yet, but hopefully I'll do that soon. I just want to know what to look for before jumping into the driver seat.
Thanks a bunch guys!
- Coming from an '05 STI
- STI is getting impractical since I feel like it's more of a race car rather than a daily driven grocery getter
- I'm getting older now and I want the feel like I'm in a comfy luxury vehicle, but be able to giggle like a little school girl when I get on the gas
- Somewhat mechanically inclined, I've done most of the work on my STI (turbo swaps, bolt-ons, suspension upgrades)
- That's really about it
1) Anyways, I keep seeing the brands AWE & APR pop up over and over again. I assume these two companies are the "go to" guys as far as aftermarket support eh? Is there any other online distributors selling aftermarket parts for these cars?
2) This nearly $2K ECU Chip thing, is there anymore info on it? Specifically, do the S4 ECU's allow you to OPEN SOURCE tune it, or do you need this special chip in order to do so?
3) I assume the most common engine performance bolt-ons are intake, downpipes, catback, and pulley upgrade correct? Is there anything else I'm missing that most of you guys looking for speed may be upgrading as well?
4) I've also read on here that there aren't any supercharger upgrades as of yet... But is there any other options to modify the existing S/C? I come from a turbo FI background, so the S/C's are a bit new to me.
5) Does anyone on the board actually have a heavily modded S4?
I know most of those questions are geared towards engine performance upgrades, however, I think I've done enough research on all other aspects of the vehicle that I found answers to. Coming from the Subaru world, there's tons of aftermarket support, and you can pretty much find upgrades to any part of the car(s).
I've looked at a few used low mileage S4's in my area already, and have seen a few that I like. Haven't test driven one yet, but hopefully I'll do that soon. I just want to know what to look for before jumping into the driver seat.
Thanks a bunch guys!
07-15-2014, 05:43 AM
#3
First off, welcome to the forum!
1. GIAC is the tuner for AWE... APR/GIAC are the top tuners on this platform and you can't go wrong either way... GIAC has a DSG tune now and APR will have one soon with more features... There are other tuners, like Revo, EPL, etc but they are second tier IMO... Plenty of other company's make parts just do some research or ask specifics and people will help.
2. No open source... It's a flash not a chip or piggyback...
3. You got it for the most part... The pulley and tune will do the most, then an open element intake, and bigger HE... Catback, headers, HFC's, etc haven't proven to do much if anything but that may change with the bigger blower... LW parts are nice as well...
4. APR will be releasing the Eaton 1.74L blower soon which is what is used on the new vette so it should help but it won't be cheap... Silly Rabbit or whatever they are called are working on a twin charged setup but it ran 12.2 on it's first passes, which is about .5 slower than the fast cars currently...
5. I have pretty much all the bolt ons, APR tune, pulley, custom intake, HFC's, downpipes, catback, CPS system, BBK, LW rear rotors, sways, alu kreuz, tranny mount, dif mount, LW wheels, etc. My car has gone 11.69 and trapped over 119 in a 500ish DA... A few others have gone 11.6x in better DA... My car will go 11.9-12.0 in the heat(3000 DA) and 11.7 all day in decent DA...
Let me know if you have any specifics and I'll be glad to help...
1. GIAC is the tuner for AWE... APR/GIAC are the top tuners on this platform and you can't go wrong either way... GIAC has a DSG tune now and APR will have one soon with more features... There are other tuners, like Revo, EPL, etc but they are second tier IMO... Plenty of other company's make parts just do some research or ask specifics and people will help.
2. No open source... It's a flash not a chip or piggyback...
3. You got it for the most part... The pulley and tune will do the most, then an open element intake, and bigger HE... Catback, headers, HFC's, etc haven't proven to do much if anything but that may change with the bigger blower... LW parts are nice as well...
4. APR will be releasing the Eaton 1.74L blower soon which is what is used on the new vette so it should help but it won't be cheap... Silly Rabbit or whatever they are called are working on a twin charged setup but it ran 12.2 on it's first passes, which is about .5 slower than the fast cars currently...
5. I have pretty much all the bolt ons, APR tune, pulley, custom intake, HFC's, downpipes, catback, CPS system, BBK, LW rear rotors, sways, alu kreuz, tranny mount, dif mount, LW wheels, etc. My car has gone 11.69 and trapped over 119 in a 500ish DA... A few others have gone 11.6x in better DA... My car will go 11.9-12.0 in the heat(3000 DA) and 11.7 all day in decent DA...
Let me know if you have any specifics and I'll be glad to help...
07-15-2014, 07:49 AM
#4
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Haven't had a Subie since 1980, but the S4 is a really special car. It can be driven leisurely like a luxury car. With Sport in "Comfort" , you can cruise around all day not feeling like you need to race anyone who pulls along side of you at a stop light. In "Dynamic" the car feels much more aggressive. Even when this car is "Going like hell" it doesn't really give you much of a sense of speed or being on the edge of losing control. Unless you are going "***** Out" on the track, there is this feeling of being in total control. FYI, if you do feel the need to mod the engine with a tune or new SC, be aware that the first time you take the car in for Audi service. they will connect the car up to the diagnostic computer and it WILL detect your tune. Audi WILL void your warranty on the engine and drivetrain and you will be designated a TD1. You dealer has no discretion on this matter. He cannot overlook that your car is modded. If you do decide to take the plunge, be sure you do get a car with the Sport differential. It cannot be retrofitted.
Last edited by DrGP; 07-15-2014 at 07:52 AM.
07-15-2014, 02:46 PM
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Wow, some pretty good info here, thanks for the warm welcomes guys!
+1 for the fellow Subie owner!
The tuning is what's got me a little more interested in how it works altogether. Coming from a WRX, I assume you know about how easy it is to open source tune those cars as well. It's just a simple flash and custom tune.
The only thing I hate about "out of box" tunes is that, it's not custom, and there's so many different variables that can effect the tune and performance.
Wow, it sounds like your S4 is heavily modded.
When you had the APR tune, did anyone actually TUNE the car (that's the part I don't get), or was it just a chip swap and done deal? Also, what kind of numbers are you putting down on the dyno? I'm sure that thing pulls like a freight train.
I'm pretty aware of voiding my warranty and such, and to be quite frank, I don't mind it. Most of the S4's I'm finding are used with 20-30K miles on the clock, so I know that I'll only have 20K or so miles left on the factory warranty. Plus I probably won't start modding the car right off the bat... Maybe some cosmetic upgrades here and there, but that's about it.
However, thanks for letting me know how comfortable and "in-control" the car is, that's one of the main reasons I'm looking into a sports luxury vehicle as my next toy
Good choice. I came from 2 WRXs, loved them, but like you I also felt as though I grew out of them. Nothing against them, but they're just abit too 'kid'.
The ECU tuning I have read about is not open source. That is to say, I have read the ECU is fairly tricky to get into, and therefore knowledge of the programming is limited. I expect in the coming years that will change, but for now I would stick to out of the box tunes. The good news: those tunes can make a HUGE difference with these cars. To the tune of making an S4 really close to an RS4.
The ECU tuning I have read about is not open source. That is to say, I have read the ECU is fairly tricky to get into, and therefore knowledge of the programming is limited. I expect in the coming years that will change, but for now I would stick to out of the box tunes. The good news: those tunes can make a HUGE difference with these cars. To the tune of making an S4 really close to an RS4.
The tuning is what's got me a little more interested in how it works altogether. Coming from a WRX, I assume you know about how easy it is to open source tune those cars as well. It's just a simple flash and custom tune.
The only thing I hate about "out of box" tunes is that, it's not custom, and there's so many different variables that can effect the tune and performance.
First off, welcome to the forum!
5. I have pretty much all the bolt ons, APR tune, pulley, custom intake, HFC's, downpipes, catback, CPS system, BBK, LW rear rotors, sways, alu kreuz, tranny mount, dif mount, LW wheels, etc. My car has gone 11.69 and trapped over 119 in a 500ish DA... A few others have gone 11.6x in better DA... My car will go 11.9-12.0 in the heat(3000 DA) and 11.7 all day in decent DA...
Let me know if you have any specifics and I'll be glad to help...
5. I have pretty much all the bolt ons, APR tune, pulley, custom intake, HFC's, downpipes, catback, CPS system, BBK, LW rear rotors, sways, alu kreuz, tranny mount, dif mount, LW wheels, etc. My car has gone 11.69 and trapped over 119 in a 500ish DA... A few others have gone 11.6x in better DA... My car will go 11.9-12.0 in the heat(3000 DA) and 11.7 all day in decent DA...
Let me know if you have any specifics and I'll be glad to help...
When you had the APR tune, did anyone actually TUNE the car (that's the part I don't get), or was it just a chip swap and done deal? Also, what kind of numbers are you putting down on the dyno? I'm sure that thing pulls like a freight train.
Haven't had a Subie since 1980, but the S4 is a really special car. It can be driven leisurely like a luxury car. With Sport in "Comfort" , you can cruise around all day not feeling like you need to race anyone who pulls along side of you at a stop light. In "Dynamic" the car feels much more aggressive. Even when this car is "Going like hell" it doesn't really give you much of a sense of speed or being on the edge of losing control. Unless you are going "***** Out" on the track, there is this feeling of being in total control. FYI, if you do feel the need to mod the engine with a tune or new SC, be aware that the first time you take the car in for Audi service. they will connect the car up to the diagnostic computer and it WILL detect your tune. Audi WILL void your warranty on the engine and drivetrain and you will be designated a TD1. You dealer has no discretion on this matter. He cannot overlook that your car is modded. If you do decide to take the plunge, be sure you do get a car with the Sport differential. It cannot be retrofitted.
However, thanks for letting me know how comfortable and "in-control" the car is, that's one of the main reasons I'm looking into a sports luxury vehicle as my next toy
07-16-2014, 10:28 AM
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One further comment:
This board is as dead as a doornail most of the time. There's a lot more action (and trolls, and flame-wars, and mis-information, but still.....) on the Audizine B8 S4 board. Look, but "enter at your own risk" ! ;-)
Enjoy the car, if you indeed get one!
This board is as dead as a doornail most of the time. There's a lot more action (and trolls, and flame-wars, and mis-information, but still.....) on the Audizine B8 S4 board. Look, but "enter at your own risk" ! ;-)
Enjoy the car, if you indeed get one!
Trending Topics
07-16-2014, 11:24 AM
#8
Wow, it sounds like your S4 is heavily modded.
When you had the APR tune, did anyone actually TUNE the car (that's the part I don't get), or was it just a chip swap and done deal? Also, what kind of numbers are you putting down on the dyno? I'm sure that thing pulls like a freight train.
When you had the APR tune, did anyone actually TUNE the car (that's the part I don't get), or was it just a chip swap and done deal? Also, what kind of numbers are you putting down on the dyno? I'm sure that thing pulls like a freight train.
As for numbers I hate dynos as they are a tool for company's to sell products and can be manipulated way to easily... With that being said my car is the one used in the ECS pulley install video and they dynoed it after the pulley install on a mustang dyno and it made 361AWHP and 345AWTQ... I am more into testing via drag racing and if you search my screen name here I made posts after most of my track visits... Car pulls pretty well though... It's a 60ft monster and it does very well from a stop light
One further comment:
This board is as dead as a doornail most of the time. There's a lot more action (and trolls, and flame-wars, and mis-information, but still.....) on the Audizine B8 S4 board. Look, but "enter at your own risk" ! ;-)
Enjoy the car, if you indeed get one!
This board is as dead as a doornail most of the time. There's a lot more action (and trolls, and flame-wars, and mis-information, but still.....) on the Audizine B8 S4 board. Look, but "enter at your own risk" ! ;-)
Enjoy the car, if you indeed get one!
http://audirevolution.net/forum/
07-16-2014, 12:46 PM
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One further comment:
This board is as dead as a doornail most of the time. There's a lot more action (and trolls, and flame-wars, and mis-information, but still.....) on the Audizine B8 S4 board. Look, but "enter at your own risk" ! ;-)
Enjoy the car, if you indeed get one!
This board is as dead as a doornail most of the time. There's a lot more action (and trolls, and flame-wars, and mis-information, but still.....) on the Audizine B8 S4 board. Look, but "enter at your own risk" ! ;-)
Enjoy the car, if you indeed get one!
07-16-2014, 02:11 PM
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One further comment:
This board is as dead as a doornail most of the time. There's a lot more action (and trolls, and flame-wars, and mis-information, but still.....) on the Audizine B8 S4 board. Look, but "enter at your own risk" ! ;-)
Enjoy the car, if you indeed get one!
This board is as dead as a doornail most of the time. There's a lot more action (and trolls, and flame-wars, and mis-information, but still.....) on the Audizine B8 S4 board. Look, but "enter at your own risk" ! ;-)
Enjoy the car, if you indeed get one!
It's getting there... The tunes/flashes for these cars and the newer ecus allow for more adjustments by the ecu... IE there is more flexibility to adapt timing and such based on conditions, fuel, etc. APR owned a B8 S4 and sold it to one of their employees but recently purchased another for DSG tuning needs... They did all the tuning on that car and sold the tune based on that... Several folks like myself who live in cooler climates did lots of data logging and drag strip testing and shared that with APR which led to some beta tunes and subsequent version changes/releases... Lets just say my ECU has visited Opelika quite a few times... lol APR also sells a 91, 93, 100, and 104 tune which can be selected via the cruise control... I believe most of their dealers can port flash now but I still send my ecu in as it's easier for me...
As for numbers I hate dynos as they are a tool for company's to sell products and can be manipulated way to easily... With that being said my car is the one used in the ECS pulley install video and they dynoed it after the pulley install on a mustang dyno and it made 361AWHP and 345AWTQ... I am more into testing via drag racing and if you search my screen name here I made posts after most of my track visits... Car pulls pretty well though... It's a 60ft monster and it does very well from a stop light
Or join a forum with not as much banter but more technical folks who actually want to talk about their cars...
http://audirevolution.net/forum/
As for numbers I hate dynos as they are a tool for company's to sell products and can be manipulated way to easily... With that being said my car is the one used in the ECS pulley install video and they dynoed it after the pulley install on a mustang dyno and it made 361AWHP and 345AWTQ... I am more into testing via drag racing and if you search my screen name here I made posts after most of my track visits... Car pulls pretty well though... It's a 60ft monster and it does very well from a stop light
Or join a forum with not as much banter but more technical folks who actually want to talk about their cars...
http://audirevolution.net/forum/
361/345 is pretty respectful on a Mustang dyno; they're known to read a bit lower than others... I was actually hoping to see in the 400's though due to all the advertising and what not most people/companies say about having Stage 2 or Stage 3 S4's. I'll have to check out some of your posts and vids when I get more time, I'm curious to see what type of performance I can expect from an elaborate mod list.
I was thinking about: S/C pulley upgrade, intake, headers, turboback, possibly a fuel pump and bigger injectors as well (if there are any).