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Old 11-24-2013, 07:38 PM   #1
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Default TDI destroys 3.0T in 8th Gear Acceleration!

Excuse the dramatic title, but I was quite happily surprised with the 8th gear acceleration results I captured...

Recently I logged both a Q5 3.0T and my TDI on the same strip of flat, straight road, in comparable temperature, etc. Every test I did 2 passes in each car to ensure results were repeatable.

I did a handful of other comparisons (ie 0-60) which were all much closer than this one. I'll post about all of the results later, but wanted to get this one up now

This comparison was for the cars to be in M8, cruise control at 60mph and fully accelerate without kickdown, to 80 mph.

As you can see, the 3.0T makes it to 80 in an average of 15.1 seconds, while the TDI only takes 9.4 seconds!

Click the image to open in full size.

* I actually computed to 79mph since one of the runs didn't make it to 80. 79 was the highest common across all runs.

You can also note from the RPM graph data how similar the gearing is. They both have the same tranny, but the 3.0T has a 3.204 final drive, while the TDI has a 3.076. At 60mph, this results in 1484 RPM for 3.0T and 1425 RPM for TDI, hardly seems worth there being a different part. The largest difference would be about 175 RPMs at the highest RPM they have in common (~4500).

Bottom line, this resulting RPM range of 1500-2000 RPMs clearly favored the torque of the TDI

UPDATE: Here's the link to the post with all 4 comparisons:
http://forums.audiworld.com/q5-sq5-discussion-129/i-compared-3-0t-vs-tdi-4-different-performance-comparisons-here-results-2857429/#post24512811
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Present:
'14 Audi Q5 TDI, Glacier, S Line, Sport Int, Nav, B&O, Tow - website - 15k miles
'04 Porsche 911 Turbo, Speed Yellow, X50 - website - 45k miles
'09 VW Tiguan 2.0T, Candy White - Hers - 69k miles
Past:
'08 Audi A3 2.0T, Ibis White, DSG, S-line - website - 54k miles
'02 Audi S4 Avant, Imola Yellow, APR Stg3 - website - 191k miles
'01.5 VW Golf 4dr 1.8T, Satin Silver, APR Stg3 - website - 203k miles
'00 Audi A4 1.8T, Silver, APR Stg2 - website - 61k miles

Last edited by Mark P; 11-30-2013 at 11:13 AM.
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Old 11-24-2013, 07:56 PM   #2
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And people called me crazy when I said this in another thread. (though i was saying the sq5 which has a much larger gearing advantage)

Thats the beauty of a diesel.
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Old 11-24-2013, 11:00 PM   #3
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The 3.0T you used has been handicapped by Audi who decided to detune it to 270hp. Still a very impressive result nonetheless. If only Audi made the diesel available in US spec SQ5...
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Old 11-24-2013, 11:22 PM   #4
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True, but the biggest advantage a diesel engine powerful torque which in this case is higher by 45% compared to the petrol engine

3.0TFSI 400Nm (295 lb-ft)
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Old 11-25-2013, 02:09 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by koobah View Post
The 3.0T you used has been handicapped by Audi who decided to detune it to 270hp. Still a very impressive result nonetheless. If only Audi made the diesel available in US spec SQ5...
+1
Hoping that we will see the TDI by the next generation SQ5 for the 2017 model year, then I am all in. I would think it would be since the Q5 has the TDI now.
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Old 11-25-2013, 07:13 AM   #6
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Wow, talk about "cherry-picking" data. Your test is in the proverbial "wheel house" of diesel strength. How does the TDI pull over 5000 rpm, or more specifically over 4750 rpm?
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Old 11-25-2013, 07:29 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NABS4 View Post
Wow, talk about "cherry-picking" data. Your test is in the proverbial "wheel house" of diesel strength. How does the TDI pull over 5000 rpm, or more specifically over 4750 rpm?
I was thinking the same thing.

I do have to say though, Audi's power de-tuning approach on the straight 3.0T (as opposed to the SQ5 variant) makes it feel a little breathless and diesel-like as well above ~4,500.
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Old 11-25-2013, 07:32 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackSVT View Post
I was thinking the same thing.

I do have to say though, Audi's power de-tuning approach on the straight 3.0T (as opposed to the SQ5 variant) makes it feel a little breathless and diesel-like as well above ~4,500.
Yes, Audi even has the S4 tuned this way. Revo/APR can fix this trait.
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Old 11-25-2013, 08:59 AM   #9
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Originally Posted by NABS4 View Post
Wow, talk about "cherry-picking" data. Your test is in the proverbial "wheel house" of diesel strength.
I think I made both of those points clear in my post. Not trying to hide that by any means. I have 3 other comparisons I'll post as well. In all of those (or at least 2.5), the 3.0T outperformed the TDI. However the differences were much more subtle in comparison to this one, which led me to post this first. And because I have a TDI :P

I did not chose this test based on RPM (to favor the TDI) - I chose it based on a reasonable speed range (60-80mph) consistent with what some magazines test (I think 50-70) in top gear. In general, I'm not a fan of a top gear test as it favors the guy with the crappier-economy-geared vehicle. In this case, they have the same tranny and near identical final drives, so that wasn't such an issue. Also, this test came in part out of the video that was posted that claimed the TDI was "flat footed" on highway accel, for which there was some inference or we created one in that thread which tied to top gear.

Here's that post/thread:
http://forums.audiworld.com/q5-sq5-discussion-129/yet-another-tdi-owner-saying-hello-thoughts-competition-2855988-post24504521/

So yes I would have expected the TDI to outperform the 3.0T in this test, but after having driven both of them daily, I wasn't expecting the difference to be this great. All around, they seemed to perform quite similarly.

The other tests I'll post are (1-3):

1.) 0-100 in "S", ESP off, foot to floor (w/kickdown)
> Scenario: Fastest off the line (eg 0-60)

2.) 45-100 in "S", full throttle (w kickdown)
> Scenario: Similar to a common B5S4 testing range. Fastest possible from that starting point. Street-racer type comparison.

3.) 60-100 in "D", full throttle (w/o kickdown)
> Scenario: Highway passing; quickest in civilized (no "S" or kickdown) manner (ie wife/family in car)

4.) 60-80 in "M8", full throttle (w/o kickdown)
> Scenario: Top gear comparison.

Each car gets to pick their own gears for those tests so nobody can complain
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Present:
'14 Audi Q5 TDI, Glacier, S Line, Sport Int, Nav, B&O, Tow - website - 15k miles
'04 Porsche 911 Turbo, Speed Yellow, X50 - website - 45k miles
'09 VW Tiguan 2.0T, Candy White - Hers - 69k miles
Past:
'08 Audi A3 2.0T, Ibis White, DSG, S-line - website - 54k miles
'02 Audi S4 Avant, Imola Yellow, APR Stg3 - website - 191k miles
'01.5 VW Golf 4dr 1.8T, Satin Silver, APR Stg3 - website - 203k miles
'00 Audi A4 1.8T, Silver, APR Stg2 - website - 61k miles

Last edited by Mark P; 11-25-2013 at 10:27 AM.
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Old 11-25-2013, 09:39 AM   #10
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I find even in D if I floor it w/o KD it still drops a lot of cogs... The KD button is almost pointless as far as I can work out!
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Old 11-25-2013, 09:39 AM
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