New to Audi, loads of problems
07-08-2003, 05:08 PM
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New to Audi, loads of problems
Ok, bear with me. I've read some of the recent archives and I know that you guys pretty well know your chit, but I'm, well, just a girl, and don't know all of this technical stuff very well. I'm smart and I can pick up on it, but right now, I'm pretty ignorant about these cars.
I needed a car, so my husband picked up an '85 5000s for $100.
I would actually call it a 5000 POS, but hey....
Problems:
The guy who sold it to us said that it needed a catalytic converter to pass smog. It has to pass smog to be registered, and the registration ran out about 2 weeks ago. (Have to have smog to get it registered, have to get it registered to get it insured...)
The paint has what locals here call "skin cancer" where something (clear coat, maybe?) just starts to disintergrate. That's not a huge problem, only cosmetic.
The brake warning light flashes non-stop.
The power steering isn't as smooth as what I'm used to. It takes a bit of strength to make slow speed turns.
I did the thing someone suggested in a recent post about killing the engine then pumping the brakes. I wasn't sure what I was looking for, but there was a "change" in the way it felt after about 10 tries. Bad news, no?
The digital clock on the dash will not stop blinking like the minutes are being set. Did I make sense there? It goes to normal when I turn the key off. Not a problem, per se, just an irritation.
The odometer quit working at 97K.
The a/c confuses me. If I turn it on, no air comes out at all (yes, the vents are turned to the "open" position), but I swear I can hear the compressor kick in. If I turn on the defrost, air blows out of those vents nicely, but I can't tell the temp of that air becaue it's kinda hot here now. (I'm in San Diego, btw.) Thank goodness the sunroof works.
The front power windows work, but the passenger window is really slow. The back windows don't work at all. I'm game to try sanding the metal parts, but I'm not clear on how to get to them.
In rush hour traffic, it got too hot and the temp light started flashing. I was on my way to a smog test at the time, and the smog guy pointed out that a hose was leaking.
My brilliant husband (who's about as adept with cars as the average 8 month-old rottweiler) put some duct tape on it. So far it's ok, but I know it will have to be replaced soon.
Ordinarily, I drive it about 1 mile at a time, and today's the first day I've gotten it over 30 mph. At speed, it handles very well. Going slow, though, it's a little rough. The steering is harder and, I don't know how to say it, it just feels a little rough.
Oh, and in the trunk was an empty bottle of power steering fluid. Plain old, ordinary power sterring fluid. Not the Pentosin (?) I've read about.
Did I mention that there's a shimmy when I hit the brakes?
And today, leaving the garage where I got the new catalytic converter put in, the freaking door handle broke off in my hand. Inside, driver's door.
I'm pretty sure I'm leaving something out...
But, hey, on the upside... I've always heard about motorcyclists who get Harleys and suddenly find themselves in a strong but vague fraternity with anyone else who owns a Harley. Well, today I ran into (drove past, actually) several other Audi-ists and they all looked at me as if we had some kind of bond. Cool.
Any input or advice would be welcome, but frankly, I don't have the disposable income to have all these things fixed. I'm planning on a regular old tune-up tomorrow and will have about $50 left to spend.
Shannon
I needed a car, so my husband picked up an '85 5000s for $100.
I would actually call it a 5000 POS, but hey....
Problems:
The guy who sold it to us said that it needed a catalytic converter to pass smog. It has to pass smog to be registered, and the registration ran out about 2 weeks ago. (Have to have smog to get it registered, have to get it registered to get it insured...)
The paint has what locals here call "skin cancer" where something (clear coat, maybe?) just starts to disintergrate. That's not a huge problem, only cosmetic.
The brake warning light flashes non-stop.
The power steering isn't as smooth as what I'm used to. It takes a bit of strength to make slow speed turns.
I did the thing someone suggested in a recent post about killing the engine then pumping the brakes. I wasn't sure what I was looking for, but there was a "change" in the way it felt after about 10 tries. Bad news, no?
The digital clock on the dash will not stop blinking like the minutes are being set. Did I make sense there? It goes to normal when I turn the key off. Not a problem, per se, just an irritation.
The odometer quit working at 97K.
The a/c confuses me. If I turn it on, no air comes out at all (yes, the vents are turned to the "open" position), but I swear I can hear the compressor kick in. If I turn on the defrost, air blows out of those vents nicely, but I can't tell the temp of that air becaue it's kinda hot here now. (I'm in San Diego, btw.) Thank goodness the sunroof works.
The front power windows work, but the passenger window is really slow. The back windows don't work at all. I'm game to try sanding the metal parts, but I'm not clear on how to get to them.
In rush hour traffic, it got too hot and the temp light started flashing. I was on my way to a smog test at the time, and the smog guy pointed out that a hose was leaking.
My brilliant husband (who's about as adept with cars as the average 8 month-old rottweiler) put some duct tape on it. So far it's ok, but I know it will have to be replaced soon.
Ordinarily, I drive it about 1 mile at a time, and today's the first day I've gotten it over 30 mph. At speed, it handles very well. Going slow, though, it's a little rough. The steering is harder and, I don't know how to say it, it just feels a little rough.
Oh, and in the trunk was an empty bottle of power steering fluid. Plain old, ordinary power sterring fluid. Not the Pentosin (?) I've read about.
Did I mention that there's a shimmy when I hit the brakes?
And today, leaving the garage where I got the new catalytic converter put in, the freaking door handle broke off in my hand. Inside, driver's door.
I'm pretty sure I'm leaving something out...
But, hey, on the upside... I've always heard about motorcyclists who get Harleys and suddenly find themselves in a strong but vague fraternity with anyone else who owns a Harley. Well, today I ran into (drove past, actually) several other Audi-ists and they all looked at me as if we had some kind of bond. Cool.
Any input or advice would be welcome, but frankly, I don't have the disposable income to have all these things fixed. I'm planning on a regular old tune-up tomorrow and will have about $50 left to spend.
Shannon
07-08-2003, 05:47 PM
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Re: New to Audi, loads of problems
WEll, considering the investment, it doesn't sound all that bad. You are going to want to get some things fixed/checked and it is going to cost you some bucks, but I figure, nowadays, if you get a car stickered and safe and reliably running for about 1000 bucks, you can't complain too much. You already got your cat replaced. That must have been a few hundred already. I feel that someone has put "plain" PS fluid in your steering system, and it has eroded the seals. This is not good, but I believe it can be remedied by flushing the system and replacing the seals. If I am wrong about this, someone please chime in. Check the color of the fluid in the cylindrical reservoir. It is supposed to be more or less clear, not dark green. If the steering fluid is leaking, you should locate the source of the leak. The steering fluid in your car is tied into the brake backup system, which would explain the flashing red triangle which is so common in these cars. You probably also have a constant yellow triangle in the center of your instrument panel which is a ABS malfunction. Least of your concerns. The BRAKE pads also have wear sensors on them that would activate warning light, if they are low. If you have to have all your work done by mechanics, you are going to spend a lot of money getting everything checked and fixed, especially if you go to a Audi dealer. Most mechanics, sorry, just wont have the time and expertise to do everything right. Its not just because its an Audi. That's just the way they are. By the way, what kind of car does husband have? Is he going to help, or is it sink or swim? Get him to stop with the duct tape and do a permanent fix here and there. Little by little it will come together. (The coolant level is very sensitive, by the way. Sometimes adding just a little will make the light stop coming on.) It is a good idea to replace timing belt if it is unknown when it was last replaced. There are lots of little things that will drive you crazy if you let them. Don't try to do everything at once. Look on it as a long term project, because if you try to do it fast, it will break your heart and your bank.
07-08-2003, 06:42 PM
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Re: New to Audi, loads of problems
From the sound of it the car runs and you passed the smog test. That's a good thing so far.
However this car has not been maintained and it will need a lot of TLC to get it all fixed up. There is someone who's giving away parts from an Audi (look at the posts below) you may be able to get some of those (e.g. door handles, swithes, hoses etc.)
Regarding the fluids, you should probably flush all the systems, and make sure you're using the right stuff. Change the hose that's leaking. The last thing you want to have is a blown hose in 100 degree weather.
Your b0mb sounds like is ok (10 pumps) but you may need the rotors turned. While they're at it you may want them to check the pads if you need them replaced. Mind you in my experience it's not worth to turn the rotors, because they warp easily afterwords, you'd be better off buying new ones when you have the $ for them (they are not too expensive, my Brembo was 60 bucks CAN).
Audi power steering is not as light as most American cars, so that may be normal.
The door handles are tipically crappy on the 5000 cars, but I never heard one falling off. You should check why that is, perhaps it's not the handle maybe just the screws came loose.
Other than that keep checking back on the forum and keep us posted. I am sure we can get that beast going...
Good luck,
Zsolt
However this car has not been maintained and it will need a lot of TLC to get it all fixed up. There is someone who's giving away parts from an Audi (look at the posts below) you may be able to get some of those (e.g. door handles, swithes, hoses etc.)
Regarding the fluids, you should probably flush all the systems, and make sure you're using the right stuff. Change the hose that's leaking. The last thing you want to have is a blown hose in 100 degree weather.
Your b0mb sounds like is ok (10 pumps) but you may need the rotors turned. While they're at it you may want them to check the pads if you need them replaced. Mind you in my experience it's not worth to turn the rotors, because they warp easily afterwords, you'd be better off buying new ones when you have the $ for them (they are not too expensive, my Brembo was 60 bucks CAN).
Audi power steering is not as light as most American cars, so that may be normal.
The door handles are tipically crappy on the 5000 cars, but I never heard one falling off. You should check why that is, perhaps it's not the handle maybe just the screws came loose.
Other than that keep checking back on the forum and keep us posted. I am sure we can get that beast going...
Good luck,
Zsolt
07-08-2003, 07:14 PM
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Re: New to Audi, loads of problems
Actually, Z, I haven't passed smog yet. It was after 5 before I got out from getting the cat, so I just came home. I'll redo the smog tomorrow with fingers crossed.
REALLY glad to hear that you think the bomb is ok. I was sweating about that.
But the door handle, well, no I'm afraid it wasn't just the screws coming loose.
A bit of plastic at the top broke clean off leaving the screw sticking solidly out. the bottom of the handle, however, had apparently come off before. Someone had drilled a new bolt into it and then tried to epoxy it to the vinyl. I swear, some people....
The driver's side door pocket is in the trunk with all the bolt holes busted out. I'm thinking maybe a whole darned door panel from a salvage yard if I can find one...?
I had an 82 RX7 many years ago that I was constanly fiddling with, and the door panels were simple as pie to pop off. How hard is it to get into the door of the 85 5000pos?
Oh, and how do I go about getting the power window switches out so I can check the connections? Is there any significance to the fact that the front two work but the back two don't?
For now, the car is running, at least. Once it passes smog, I'm going to be mostly worried about being able to sit in it comfortably (as in windows, air...) with all those other things being addressed one by one as time and money allow.
And, thanks so very much for your post. I've read it a few times to try to let it sink in. "Under the hood" has never really been my forte, but I'm willing to learn.
Shannon
REALLY glad to hear that you think the bomb is ok. I was sweating about that.
But the door handle, well, no I'm afraid it wasn't just the screws coming loose.
A bit of plastic at the top broke clean off leaving the screw sticking solidly out. the bottom of the handle, however, had apparently come off before. Someone had drilled a new bolt into it and then tried to epoxy it to the vinyl. I swear, some people....
The driver's side door pocket is in the trunk with all the bolt holes busted out. I'm thinking maybe a whole darned door panel from a salvage yard if I can find one...?
I had an 82 RX7 many years ago that I was constanly fiddling with, and the door panels were simple as pie to pop off. How hard is it to get into the door of the 85 5000pos?
Oh, and how do I go about getting the power window switches out so I can check the connections? Is there any significance to the fact that the front two work but the back two don't?
For now, the car is running, at least. Once it passes smog, I'm going to be mostly worried about being able to sit in it comfortably (as in windows, air...) with all those other things being addressed one by one as time and money allow.
And, thanks so very much for your post. I've read it a few times to try to let it sink in. "Under the hood" has never really been my forte, but I'm willing to learn.
Shannon
07-08-2003, 07:36 PM
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Re: New to Audi, loads of problems
Hey, Trag. Thanks for your reply. Yes, considering the investment, it's all good, yo.
I was able to get the cat for under $200, if you can believe that. I was pretty stoked about that. Making a lot of phone calls and having a sweet Texas-girl voice really pays off sometimes.
I'm going tomorrow to get a tune-up with a mechanic I seemed to click with on the phone. I'm hoping to develop a good relationship with him so that I can trust him and can ask him things.
While he's not an "Audi" mechanic, he did seem to know them pretty well. I'll ask him to look at the things that you and Z suggested and tell me, you know, what's what.
Hubby, since you asked, is currently driving MY van (97 Nissan Quest), but I can't hold that against him. Because he has an actual commute and I just have to drive around the block to the elementary school, I figured he should have the more reliable car. He was kinda shocked by the suggestion, but he wasted no time taking me up on it. Damn him. I'm better with this sort of thing anyhow. He'd just drive it until it wouldn't go anymore, whereas I'm more likely to get things taken care of.
And, Yes, I do have that little yellow triangle! I wondered what that was. I did find the owner's manual in the trunk, but it looks like it soaked in a bucket of water for a few months then got left in the sun for a few years. The pages a totally stuck together and cannot be read at all, so I have no way of knowing what all the little controls are.
I did add coolant after the smog guy pointed out the leak, and the light went off for about 200 yards. It came back on after that and has been on ever since.
Like you said, I'm planning on doing what I can when I can, as a long-term project. I feel a lot better having heard from you guys.
I hope if anyone sees an "emergency" situation that would kill the car altogether if not fixed NOW, you'll let me know.
I'll do my best to keep you posted on how things are shaping up.
Shannon
I was able to get the cat for under $200, if you can believe that. I was pretty stoked about that. Making a lot of phone calls and having a sweet Texas-girl voice really pays off sometimes.
I'm going tomorrow to get a tune-up with a mechanic I seemed to click with on the phone. I'm hoping to develop a good relationship with him so that I can trust him and can ask him things.
While he's not an "Audi" mechanic, he did seem to know them pretty well. I'll ask him to look at the things that you and Z suggested and tell me, you know, what's what.
Hubby, since you asked, is currently driving MY van (97 Nissan Quest), but I can't hold that against him. Because he has an actual commute and I just have to drive around the block to the elementary school, I figured he should have the more reliable car. He was kinda shocked by the suggestion, but he wasted no time taking me up on it. Damn him. I'm better with this sort of thing anyhow. He'd just drive it until it wouldn't go anymore, whereas I'm more likely to get things taken care of.
And, Yes, I do have that little yellow triangle! I wondered what that was. I did find the owner's manual in the trunk, but it looks like it soaked in a bucket of water for a few months then got left in the sun for a few years. The pages a totally stuck together and cannot be read at all, so I have no way of knowing what all the little controls are.
I did add coolant after the smog guy pointed out the leak, and the light went off for about 200 yards. It came back on after that and has been on ever since.
Like you said, I'm planning on doing what I can when I can, as a long-term project. I feel a lot better having heard from you guys.
I hope if anyone sees an "emergency" situation that would kill the car altogether if not fixed NOW, you'll let me know.
I'll do my best to keep you posted on how things are shaping up.
Shannon
07-08-2003, 08:47 PM
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Re: New to Audi, loads of problems
I would say that the coolant leak is an emergency as cooking the head could kill the car. Start there. Next in order of importance is flushing the power steering fluid out of the hydraulic system. The rough steering and the brake light could mean that it is too late for the seals, but replacing the entire system would cost you more than another 5000 in better condition so you could at least try and get the bad stuff out.
Good luck,
Good luck,
07-08-2003, 08:50 PM
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Re: New to Audi, loads of problems
> How hard is it to get into the door of the 85 5000pos?
Fairly easy. Two small screws in the pannel top front and back. Screwdriver to pry off the plactic center of the door handle and then three phillips screws. One small phillips in center of the inside door handle plastic and slides forward and out. Pry out small plastic triangle at front of window. Pry out the plastic plug snaps around the bottom of the panel and lift off. Don't think that I forgot anything.
> Oh, and how do I go about getting the power window switches out so I can check the
connections?
Pry and lift them out. OTOH, see below.
> Is there any significance to the fact that the front two work but the back
> two don't?
There is a square button by the window switches which is used to deactivate the rear window switches in the rear doors. Try to operated this a few times and it my fix things.
OR
The most common problem for a number of things including windows, mirrors ... is broken wires in the bunch of wires that goes from the driver side kick panel into the drivers door through a rubber accordian looking tube. Open this and inspect for frayed and broken wires and reair any that look bad. Often cures a lot of issues.
Loosing coolant? If you think you are and can't find a leak, pull the spark plugs and see if they look colored green like the antifreeze. If they do call us again and we will discuss your options.
Do this b4 other expenses.
Tony
'91 100Q 5spd
Fairly easy. Two small screws in the pannel top front and back. Screwdriver to pry off the plactic center of the door handle and then three phillips screws. One small phillips in center of the inside door handle plastic and slides forward and out. Pry out small plastic triangle at front of window. Pry out the plastic plug snaps around the bottom of the panel and lift off. Don't think that I forgot anything.
> Oh, and how do I go about getting the power window switches out so I can check the
connections?
Pry and lift them out. OTOH, see below.
> Is there any significance to the fact that the front two work but the back
> two don't?
There is a square button by the window switches which is used to deactivate the rear window switches in the rear doors. Try to operated this a few times and it my fix things.
OR
The most common problem for a number of things including windows, mirrors ... is broken wires in the bunch of wires that goes from the driver side kick panel into the drivers door through a rubber accordian looking tube. Open this and inspect for frayed and broken wires and reair any that look bad. Often cures a lot of issues.
Loosing coolant? If you think you are and can't find a leak, pull the spark plugs and see if they look colored green like the antifreeze. If they do call us again and we will discuss your options.
Do this b4 other expenses.
Tony
'91 100Q 5spd
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07-08-2003, 09:01 PM
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Front door panel removal procedure
I just had mine off, so it's fresh . . .
You'll need two Phillips head screwdrivers (#1 and #0 size, I think) and a panel pry tool (red handle sorta screwdriver with crooked shank and forked blade - $7.00 by Lisle, from Pep Boys).
Use a clear plastic ziplock freezer bag to temporarily stash the many small fasteners and bits involved.
Starting at top, remove:
o Door lockbutton. (Turn counter clockwise to remove it.)
o One small Phillips head screw at triangular piece above waistline, front of door. Use pry tool to pry (from top! If you pry from bottom you'll break one or two tabs.) triangular plastic piece free of door.
o One medium size Phillips head screw at waistline either end of door panel (two total), in door jamb.
o One small Phillips head screw behind the chrome door latch, within the escutcheon. There may be a tiny D shaped cover over top this screw, which may be pryed off with a fingernail or sharp pick. Operate door latch and remove its escutcheon plate.
Using panel pry tool, pry from bottom of door handle 'til door handle cover pops off. Three medium Phillips head screws fasten the handle to door. Unscrew all three and remove handle.
Removal of handle will reveal a medium size Phillips head screw that fastens door panel to underlying door frame. Remove.
At this point door panel is hanging by clips from waistline and fastened with 9 little plastic push on / pull off fasteners around bottom perimeter. Use pry tool at bottom edge of door panel to pry panel away from door. Work tool around bottom perimeter.
When all plastic fasteners are free, disconnect electrical connectors from harness(es). Lift up and wiggle on door panel to lift it clear of door.
Next obstacle is sheet of insulation that hangs from waistline by three wide shoulder plastic fasteners. You can just lift this or use pry tool to pop off three fasteners and remove insulation.
You're now inside the door, with latch, lock mechanism and power window accessible. You should lube the track and cable for window with grease.
As the books say, re-assembly is reverse of disassembly.
Find and buy a shop manual for your car. The Haynes manual is only about $14 and fairly useful. The Bentley manual is more comprehensive but more expensive.
Good luck,
Russ Bellew
You'll need two Phillips head screwdrivers (#1 and #0 size, I think) and a panel pry tool (red handle sorta screwdriver with crooked shank and forked blade - $7.00 by Lisle, from Pep Boys).
Use a clear plastic ziplock freezer bag to temporarily stash the many small fasteners and bits involved.
Starting at top, remove:
o Door lockbutton. (Turn counter clockwise to remove it.)
o One small Phillips head screw at triangular piece above waistline, front of door. Use pry tool to pry (from top! If you pry from bottom you'll break one or two tabs.) triangular plastic piece free of door.
o One medium size Phillips head screw at waistline either end of door panel (two total), in door jamb.
o One small Phillips head screw behind the chrome door latch, within the escutcheon. There may be a tiny D shaped cover over top this screw, which may be pryed off with a fingernail or sharp pick. Operate door latch and remove its escutcheon plate.
Using panel pry tool, pry from bottom of door handle 'til door handle cover pops off. Three medium Phillips head screws fasten the handle to door. Unscrew all three and remove handle.
Removal of handle will reveal a medium size Phillips head screw that fastens door panel to underlying door frame. Remove.
At this point door panel is hanging by clips from waistline and fastened with 9 little plastic push on / pull off fasteners around bottom perimeter. Use pry tool at bottom edge of door panel to pry panel away from door. Work tool around bottom perimeter.
When all plastic fasteners are free, disconnect electrical connectors from harness(es). Lift up and wiggle on door panel to lift it clear of door.
Next obstacle is sheet of insulation that hangs from waistline by three wide shoulder plastic fasteners. You can just lift this or use pry tool to pop off three fasteners and remove insulation.
You're now inside the door, with latch, lock mechanism and power window accessible. You should lube the track and cable for window with grease.
As the books say, re-assembly is reverse of disassembly.
Find and buy a shop manual for your car. The Haynes manual is only about $14 and fairly useful. The Bentley manual is more comprehensive but more expensive.
Good luck,
Russ Bellew
07-08-2003, 11:09 PM
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Walk away.
Hi Shannon,
Sorry to read you got yourself such a poorly maintained example of a 5000. I own a 1990 200q with 195k miles. And I've been working on cars and bikes for almost 20 yrs. To be quite blunt and honest, Audis are maintenance intensive cars, especially as they age. My car was in better condition than yours and I still needed to put an ungodly amount of time, sweat, tears and money into her. She's still not a complete car.
My advice to you is to unload your car immediately.
There is a reason why it only costed $100. So far,
you've only invested $200 for the cat, expect to spend 10x that in the days to come.
I regretfully must inform you that the bomb is dead. A good bomb yield over 20 pumps, 10 means the nitrogen charge is depleted.
Your hydraulic system is contaminated and the steering rack, pump seals will fail. A rebuilt rack costs $250 w/o labor. You can try a Pentosin 7.1S flush and hope for the best. Cost is $12-20/liter, and 4-5 liters are needed.
Electrical problems are aplenty on Audis. Your window issues are most likely broken wiring in the driver's door accordian boot.
Climate control is suffering from a vacuum leak in the system. The vent flaps aren't operating. Your A/C still may not be working due to a loss of refrigerant. Even if air is blowing from the defrost vent, it should be cold if the A/C is operating.
Since there isn't a shadetree mechanic in your family, you are best off getting a more reliable make/model of car. Actually, take back your Nissan and force your husband to find himself a car.
Sorry to read you got yourself such a poorly maintained example of a 5000. I own a 1990 200q with 195k miles. And I've been working on cars and bikes for almost 20 yrs. To be quite blunt and honest, Audis are maintenance intensive cars, especially as they age. My car was in better condition than yours and I still needed to put an ungodly amount of time, sweat, tears and money into her. She's still not a complete car.
My advice to you is to unload your car immediately.
There is a reason why it only costed $100. So far,
you've only invested $200 for the cat, expect to spend 10x that in the days to come.
I regretfully must inform you that the bomb is dead. A good bomb yield over 20 pumps, 10 means the nitrogen charge is depleted.
Your hydraulic system is contaminated and the steering rack, pump seals will fail. A rebuilt rack costs $250 w/o labor. You can try a Pentosin 7.1S flush and hope for the best. Cost is $12-20/liter, and 4-5 liters are needed.
Electrical problems are aplenty on Audis. Your window issues are most likely broken wiring in the driver's door accordian boot.
Climate control is suffering from a vacuum leak in the system. The vent flaps aren't operating. Your A/C still may not be working due to a loss of refrigerant. Even if air is blowing from the defrost vent, it should be cold if the A/C is operating.
Since there isn't a shadetree mechanic in your family, you are best off getting a more reliable make/model of car. Actually, take back your Nissan and force your husband to find himself a car.
