I hope you all have a chip as well. I'm trying to figure out something that has been plagueing(sp) me from the beginning of my mods.<p>Every 1 bar chip I've used whether it was for the K03 or the K04, in my car I get 18-20lbs of boost. Now before you say, it's the point where I've tapped the manifold pressure or my boost guage. Let me tell you that when I was running the Profec (not doing that right now), it's boost guage matched mine exactly. BTW, I taped the manifold pressure line right at that little nipple on the back of the fuel pressure regulator or valve close to it, you know the little one with a light green cap on it.<p>Ok, so, here's the poll question.<p>Anyone else that's running a chip and has a boost guage seen the phenomena? Both Don P. and I have the same issue. <p>Don't think it means better power, it actually is hurting power. The reason, the boost rises sooooo fast that the timing can't keep up and the ECU pulls out a bunch of timing and well you know the rest of the story, it's actually more complicated than that, but this should suffice. Anyway, 1.5bar does not equal more HP, in fact, I'd bet the car actually performs more like .7 bar. The reason I know this. With the Profec (yea, I know, I should go back to it), I could limit the boost to 1.0 bar. At 14.5lbs (which is 1.0bar for those that are curious), my car ran a ton better than it does on the ECU only with a 1.0bar chip that makes 1.5bar!<p>I need to sort this out. There is something that is different between mine and Don's car and the rest of you guys. I don't know if it's the frequency valve, the MAP, or something else, but it doesn't matter what ECU is in there and it doesn't seem to matter what chip, they all create way too much boost!!!<p>Any ideas? or comments, hopefully creative!<p>Thanks,<br>Alan

This comes from an unbiased, 2.8 30V owner (!):<p>Is the wastegate electronically controlled in the 1.8T? I will assume that it is because a mechanical wastegate would pretty much be fixed at a certain pressure & would require replacement for higher pressure apps & the 1.8T only needs a new chip.<p>Ok, so here goes: Has Wett looked to see if there is a built in lag between manifold pressure & wastegate control? For example, this is a process & requires process control: Boost is too high...open wastegate. How much to open wastegate is a function of the error where error=(current pressure) - (set pressure, 1.0bar). Now, for true process control, you also try to use the slope of the pressure vs. time curve (derivative) and the total area under the pressure vs. time curve (integral) to arrive at the best position for the wastegate. Now, whether or not Audi used a PID (proportional-integral-derivate) control scheme here, I dunno. But a PID system will have some lag. A straight proportional control will have lag & offset & oscillation. Luckily we're dealing with short duration at the high end of boost, so I doubt there is any sophisticated control scheme...but there is probably some kind of scheme which may or may not have a lag "built in".<p>If there is not, then there is a lag somewhere, electronic or mechanical, I know not:<p>(1) MAP sensor (on my last supercharged FORD, I found that these things don't like rapid boost/vacuum/boost cycles). I'd try & diagnose this by recording the MAP signal during a drive & comparing it to your boost gauge. A lag would show up immediately if you have the real-time recording from a laptop like donp. Course you need a second person to drive!<p>(2) Some electronic lag as the ECU computes the wastegate position from the MAP signal, then sends the signal to the wastegate. This, again, could be seen with real-time data logging. <p>(3) Mechanical lag in the wastegate actuation. If it opens slowly (bad or just wrong application solenoid). You should be able to test this actuation & get a feel for how fast it happens. Easier with the turbo assembly removed :(<p>Question: Why not install a pop-off valve in the intake line that relieves anything above 1 bar? Seems cheap, easy & isn't really a kludge, because you need the control & you're actually helping the ECU get where it needs to go rather than "fooling" it.<p>steve

Good ideas, I'll do some further investigation. There is a sensor called a "frequency valve" that sets between the boost side of the TC and the WG. It is electronically controlled and I've ordered a new one just for kicks to see if that provides any difference. It seems these two cars are way different in some aspect than the others out that. At least that I know of. With chips that I know on other boost guages in other cars give 15lbs. We both bet around 19-20. And you know the rest of the problem. I first stumbled onto this before I replace the turbo with the K04. I was going down the road with 1.0bar chips and I got one that caused the car to detonate really bad. I sent it back and got a WETT and it did the same, then I added the boost guage and found that I was getting 18-20lbs of boost, I'm sure the first ECU that I got was doing the same, I just figured it was the programming. I suppose it still could be, but there are alot of WETT 1.0bar chips out there and only those that don't run 93 octane get occasional detonation and they don't have 18-20lbs of boost. There must be something in this car that is causing that and the only thing that I can think of is the wastegate release mechanism or Frequency valve. I've also heard that there have been some problems in this area, so I'll try that first, then maybe I'll try some different programming and go from there. This is the last quirk I have to work out, once it's done, I'm done tinkering!<p>Thanks again,<br>Alan

alan,<p>i am running an autometer guage with my wett 1.0 chip...i get a max boost of 14...i did not tap into the green nipple because the people at greedspeed said that i would get an inaccurate reading from that location. i tapped into the line that runs in front of that valve...i used a T fitting and some clamps. i followed the instructions on <br>Sean's Audi page...hope this helps...<p>joe

Did a little surfing becuase I am unfamiliar with that term. Best I can tell is that it appears to function like an EGR valve (Exhaust gas recirculation). Used for emission control by letting exhaust back into the intake. <p>If this is true, then it should be SHUT during wide open throttle, like an EGR valve. If not & it is connected to the high pressure exhaust side (pre impeller), then manifold pressure would rise to approach exhaust manifold pressure. You'd run lean & have detonation.<p>steve..."of course, I could be completely wrong!"

With the Wetterauer 1bar, I've never been able to push it past 15lbs on an Autometer gauge.<p>Sorry to hear about this problem you are having. I hope it will get corrected soon.<p>Cris<br>

Almost, it's a little valve (about 2" long and about 3/4" around) that plugs into the hose between the airbox and the intake side of the turbo. It has two small (1/4") lines that come two it. One from the pressure side of the turbo and one to the wastegate. In fact it is the wastegate controller. There is also an signal line that runs back to the airbox, probably the mass air sensor. I've now been told that the ECU uses mass air sensor to determine boost. That is it reads CFM flow to determine whether to open or close the wastegate. I thought there was a MAP, maybe there is, but I can understand the other as well. Anyway, it could be the MAF, or it could be the frequency valve that is in different tollerance and is reacting with the 1.0bar chips parameters. Then again, it could just be the programming that I'm using.<p>I'm trying to determine which it is. First we'll try the frequency valve change and if that doesn't work, maybe I'll see about a different MAF. Or maybe software can just fix it all together.<p>Alan

MAF sensors are notorious for only working within a certain region with any accuracy.<p>That MAF is probably an off the shelf unit with parameters that can be gotten from the vendor. Find out what range over which they claim accuracy.<p>From the diameter, boost, and charge temp, we can calculate a rough estimate of your actual mass air flow & determine if you have exceeded the design specs for the stock unit.<p>steve

Nice to have someone else who talks the lingo. BTW, did you say Ford tuning... How about 351 Windor with 10lbs Vortech SC on a 1996 Saleen 351R. With a little tuning from Mike... Geez, I can't remember his last name it will come to me. We were 465 to the rear wheels!!!! That was 550 at the crank! Too bad it was too finicky (sp). I hated messing with it so I sold it (made money on the deal) and downsized to the A4, still wanted something that I could play with and tune up to about 250ish. I'm almost there, if I could just solve this over boost issue, I should be there. Now if I could just figure out how to dyno a Q car! :-)<p>Alan

Sorry for the off-topic, jumping into someone elses converstation...but, my friend has a supercharged Lightning... he is toying with the engine yet again through winter to get more horses out of it. Anyway, he was running maybe 11sec 1/4 mile time!! Not bad for something that weights in at over 4000 lbs! :)<p>

Is that trunk up in the Michigan, Ohio area... I know of a T series Vorteched, Mike tuned Lightning that is making awsome HP. I've seen it on a dyno and I was sworn to secrecy about the numbers!!!<p>Alan

Sometimes I get 16 and occasionally 17 on my meter which I believe is accurate. I also tapped at the existing nipple. I use Sunoco 94 exclusively. I haven't been able to identify why the performance varies. I suspect it has to do with ambient temperature. I have only had the boost guage installed since the colder weather has arrived and it seems to boost higher on days between 25 and 50. Maybe the intercooler acts to warm up the cold air and cause a further increase in pressure?<p>Let's hear from some non-Wett owners...<p>Regards,<br>Mike 1.8TQM-Wett Yellow<br>

It was too far to meet in person, but he gave me some advice.<p>I was running a relatively (compared to your description!) mild app: 95 Bronco, 351W 6.5psi Kenne Bell kit. Problem was: no one made a kit to go mass air from speed density (a problem in itself) with fuel management unit causing rich running at throttle. Didn't run bad, just knew it was capable of much more.<p>The next step was to get it tuned with someone using Wesley's hardware/software. They can tune the FMU completely out with bigger injectors & fuel pump & remap all the fuel/timing curves with a dyno. Found a guy in Mobile, AL to do it. Then, I took stock of how much $$ was flowing into the truck & how many headaches it was causing. Didn't like the numbers.<p>So the A4 bug bit me (and you know why I skipped the 1.8T...tooooooo many opportunities to flirt with power, bankruptcy, or disaster!). <----Audi content

I've got some very interesting comments so far, please keep this going, I need to establish a pattern. I'll post my results after a bit more data gathering. I'm also trying some potential fixes and some data gathering to see if I can determine if it is programming or sensor related.<p>Alan

With my Wett 1.0 bar chip I can hit about 14 PSI at full boost which rather promptly drops down to 12 PSI. I haven't seen it go higher.<p>I'm using an Autometer gauge.<p>Sean<br>97 1.8Tqm