Hah, I knew that would get your attention...<p>Just thought I'd give everyone my impressions of yesterday's Thunderhill Street School.<br>I was the only A4, and half of the instructors remembered me!<p>What a BLAST! A beautiful cool autumn day, perfect for driving on the dry track.<p>They had a record 96 students at the event, giving in to tremendous pressure (they called it "begging") by the students.<p>Among the notable participants: my A4, 10 Boxsters, 5 NSXs, 5 or 6 M3s (two Dinans), 6 RX-7s, 1 souped up Z3, 1 Integra Type R, 3 Mustangs, a handful of 911s, a 996, a Firebird, a Toyota 4Runner, a Jeep Grand Cherokee, an El Camino, a Dodge Ram full-sized pickup with snow tires (It's a wonder how that guy managed to stay put in that bench seat)...<p>Very very few off-tracks or spin-outs, only 2 spin-outs among the Boxsters. I even stayed on track the entire day! I even kept up with some of the Boxster first-timers on the track, which impressed a lot of the folks.<p>I finally got turn 7 nailed down. Wahoo!<p>Best food of the day: my Taco Bell run into town...<p>Worst wipe-out of the day: a beautiful pearlescent purple M3 took turn 3 waaay too fast, overcorrected by turning back to the right, lifted off the accelerator, and rammed straight into the side of the hill on the right side. The front bumper was in pieces. Fortunately, nobody was hurt, the only casualty was the M3 owner's pride... Yes, it was in the exact same location in turn 3 where I "met" Bert's car head-on in turn three in that cloud of dust last month...<p>BEST TREAT OF THE DAY:<br>They opened up the West side of the track for solo runs! WAHOO!!!! I've never had so much fun in my life. Everyone got to go solo on the west side for 3 self-counted, untimed laps (but I accidentally mis-counted and went around for 6 or 7 laps until the track steward gave me a dirty look as I went around for my 7th lap... It's a really nice straightaway with a really sharp left-hand turn up a hill (I wish I had a stronger 2nd gear because the Boxsters kept leaving me in the dust during that climb), a fast crest and sweeping left-hand turn down the hill to a 90-degree left and then a trip through an s-curve before heading back on the straightaway...<p>They solicited opinions about the west side and received overwhelmingly positive feedback, so they would probably allow runs on the west side in the future. And since there were zero incidents on that side of the track, they are also strongly considering opening up the entire track to future street schools... I also suggested they set up a slalom section in addition to the threshold braking exercise, they really liked that idea too.<p>All in all, a fantastic day, lots of really fun and nice people, especially the Boxster folks who really liked my A4. (I also overheard a lot of comments from lots of other people as I drove to the staging area, mostly "Wow, those A4s are REALLY nice" and I got lots of compliments from passers-by who would stop by and ask questions about the car. It felt GREAT!)<p>I took a few pictures, and also took some group shots with the Boxster folks who even let me park my A4 next to their row of Boxsters (or should I say, I let them park their Boxsters next to my A4) for a group shot. I'll post pictures or throw this stuff up on a web site pretty soon, or at least whenever I get around to it...<p>Maybe in the future we can arrange an A4-Boxster day at Thunderhill...<p>Can't wait to go back!!!<p>-PhilJ

Phil, was your total track time reduced due to the<br>high number of participants?<p>Corey S<br>Wett 97 1.8TQM

Actually, total track time was reduced as they ended up with someting like 32 cars per group. They ended up splitting the groups into two shorter 12-minute sessions. <p>It was kinda disspointing, actually, since there was a lot more down time between track sessions. That was the only major complaint about the day that was pretty much unanimous. But for me, opening up the west side more than made up for it.<p>-Phil

Forgive me, but SUVs at a track event? Did they have some kind of special suspensions on those things, I hope? I can't imagine top-heavy SUVs pushing the limits and not losing it.<br>Scary story, a certain person (who has an SCCA license)was driving my A4qm (with modified suspension) this past weekend, and was witness to a major disaster. A Dodge Durango driver who apparently was far too overconfident, was driving his SUV at speeds too fast for his own good. He followed the A4Q around a long carousel highway interchange. In trying to keep up with the nimble and very tight A4, he lost it big time, went off the ramp and smashed up his SUV big time. Why do people think they can drive SUVs like performance sports cars? How do you think he explains that one to the cops/insurance co. /wife etc.??<br>Anyway, back to my original question. Were these SUVs and pickups modified? They can't stop very well at high speeds according to what I've read and they certainly topple over if pushed too hard. I sure as heck don't ever want to be in a run group with an SUV or pickup!<br>-C.

Cathleen, at our second visit to Thunderhill, someone brought a new CJ7 jeep (4.0L) and competed....check out the pics on the NorCal A4 owners club page. It is under Thunderhill Trip #2. (yes, we had a pic)<p>It was funny.<p>Steve S.<br>97 2.8QM<br><ul><li><a href="http://www.ns.net/~seang">Sean's A4 Page/NorCal Club Page</a></li></ul>

.....is pretty sweet. I quite fondly remember being the first group to ever run on that<br>side, with Steve S, Sean G, and many other Audi quattros. And in the rain, no less.<p>Corey S<br>Wett 97 1.8TQM

Actually, turns out I know that guy, or at least went to high school with him. <p>He's been racing autocross and track events since he was 13, and used to autocross his Austin Minis all the time. <p>-PhilJ<br>

They didn't seem to be fixed up at all, but I didn't pay too much attention to them since they were in a different group (A, while I was in the "experienced/better driver" C group).<p>I heard lots of tire squealing, tho...<p>-Phil

<br>I used to throw a Dodge W100 Powerwagon awd half-ton PU around pretty hard. I rode for a parade lap around TWS in a full-size four door Silverado. I have seen an S10 Blazer and S10 pickup go head to head in autocross. They ran competitive times with H Stock!!!<p>It's all about the driver. You can thrash an SUV just as hard as anything else, but the driving style is different, and it is slower than the same driver in a car. You have to know that it's an SUV and not a car. I switched to an Audi primarily because the brakes in the Dodge were made for towing, not hard stops, and the gas mileage sucked, and it didn't fit anywhere.<p>Now I have more fun driving the Audi, but I got my start in an AWD PU!!! :-)<p>Todd W

Suzuki Sidekicks<br>Isuzu Trooper<br>MiniVans from Chrysler/Ford/GM/Toyota<br>Dodge K car station wagon<br>Ford pickup trucks<br>Mercury Grand Marquis (dubbed "Grand Marquis de Sade" for the day)<br>Volvo wagon (went like stink, actually)<br>and hundreds of unidentifiable rent-a-cars (because its ALWAYS easier to RETURN than REPAIR)<p>John/TSR

Granted, you can take just about anything on a track, but without a good suspension and brakes....no thanks.<br>Having driven a few SUVs, I can say that they are not performance oriented (unless they're a purpose built race vehicle). It really is scary that people are driving them like they are cars on the open roads (let alone a racetrack). Sure they can go fast but can they handle well or stop quickly from high speeds? It's more like piloting a boat! Moose test, anyone?<p><br>

<br>An SUV can do anything 95% of drivers do with their cars on the open roads. As for the track, would you rather dance or have an amusing physical challenge? How fast can you turn a 30" steering wheel 12 times lock-to-lock and back again? :-) I agree that a properly set up car is much better suited to the track, but an SUV can also be fun, especially for the people watching. Don't knock it 'til you try it. <p>Enter that turn too fast? Just use the shortcut!<p>Black flag<br>pit out; "You had 4 wheels off in turn 7"<br>driver;"but sir, it's an SUV!"<p>Todd W

I just prefer the point and shoot and stop-on-a- dime kind of vehicle. I like going really fast and it's just not the same kind of fun when I've driven the SUV and not been able to do the same speeds through the turns.<br>Rallying is fun, but there again, I'd like one of those small, nimble, rally cars.<br>To each his/her own, I guess.<br>;)<br>-C.

I just have to comment on this one...<p>I'm not an SUV owner, but I do drive a "non-performance" car "to the limit" a lot of the time. The point is that you can take any car and use momentum through corners, low speeds, and sharp corners to have a lot of fun, and it has nothing to do with "performance" its all about having a good time. 4-wheel slides at 25 miles an hour are pretty easy if you have a '71 beetle.<p>I get a REAL kick of passing Bimmers/vettes/etc on the 101, and seeing their reaction. They just have to pass me back, and you know what, I just let them have their fun, 'cause I've already had mine.<p>(Yah, I know, I'm crazy. I drive a known unsafe 27 year old car 70 miles a day, at 75 miles an hour on one of the busiest highways in Northern California. ) <p>Steve<p>'99 1.8Tqm on order...<p>

It's better that they tested the limits of handling in a safe, controlled environment rather than out on the streets with traffic.<p>As a matter of fact, the drivers of aforementioned SUVs and pickup trucks actually did very well, never going out of control or spinning out or going off track, they kept their speeds low enough to stay in control without hitting the limits...<p>-Phil

That is very true. They can learn a lot about their vehicle's limitations/capabilities that way. It would be great to make a requirement for ALL SUV drivers to take a school, so they don't do what that Dodge Durango guy did. <p><br>

Power sliding in a Beetle or similar-sized car and having a little fun is fine by me. What noone is acknowledging about my concern is when a HUGE vehicle is being driven well over 100mph by a maniac and then careening off of an entracnce ramp into a gully, back onto the e-way and crashing into a barrier. This was actually witnessed last weekend!<br>That is what I think is insane. People who think their SUV is a racecar. It's unsafe and I sure as hell don't want to be a victim of one of those runaway trains. I see these people on the road practically every day and it seems to be getting way out of control. <br>

Cathleen,<p>Some idiot in a Jeep Cherokee tood a turn too fast, and not tight enough into a parking lot the other night. When they turned in, I was just pulling out to the street. needless to say, they almost drove right into the front of my car. I had to steer right and hit the brakes to avoid a collision with that top heavy beast being driven by an underexperienced teenager. What I really like is when I'm already driving 10-15 MPH over the speed limit and someone in a Suburban is following about 10 feet behind my bumper. I hate looking at the front of those damn things in my rearview mirror. Scares me to think of how much faster my car would stop in the event I needed to do so. My idea of a good day is not having a Suburban grill in my back seat. <p>Charles<br>