Okay so obviously I'm going to get some biased opinions on here, but that's fine - I want to hear what everyone's got to say!

In the past I've had an E36 M3, and that car was generally a pleasure to own/drive - I did appreciate the nuances of German engineering and driving dynamics, so I miss that a bit.

Currently I have a Mustang GT (yeah yeah, I know this is about the least welcoming place for 'stang owner, but I'm not really the stereotypical type.. the new mustangs are worlds apart from the old redneck varieties lol) I pretty much stole the thing from a dealer when gas was $4/gal, did most of the work at my shop, and have less than 20k into the entire project with all mods.

Last winter I got a '99 Land Rover Discovery II as a "beater" car, since they depreciated to the level of similarly-priced beaters like an Isuzu Trooper or something.. so it was a no-brainer. I understood the work I'd have to do but that was fine. I fixed a lot of stuff, got the auto-leveling air suspension working again, etc etc.. has 2 sunroofs, harmon/kardon sound, digital climate control, etc for $3,500 ;)

Anyways I can't take it anymore haha, even for a very mechanically-inclined person like myself, things are breaking faster than I can fix them. :( As-is I can sell it for ~30% more than I bought it for though.

Basically I'd like the best of both worlds - the image and performance of the Mustang, with the utility and off-road abilities of the Discovery. I'm not one of those people who will never use both extremes either - I fully plan on using the tow ratings and off-road features of anything I buy (disco has a 7700lb rating back in '99!) probably a 2-horse straight-load trailer, maybe a single car hauler, etc. I've got a lot of friends that live out in the back roads of a really nice town near me - some areas even have roads that cross creeks without bridges, and as the east-coasters know - we got 74" of snow last year in Northern VA. I'll be using that quattro to its' full extent.

Performance isn't really all that important, but the image is - the Discovery is nice, but at ~5400lbs with a 180hp V8, I'm THOROUGHLY sick of having everyone cut me off when lanes are engine, at every light, etc etc (even if I'm going the speed of traffic, the just wanna cut off the "box" in their way!) I'm pretty much helpless with that level of power in most situations where there are d-bag aggressive drivers, etc. Just kinda sit back and let it happen (and coming from the Mustang, that's VERY frustrating!) I do love the "go anywhere/do anything" feel of it though; it's a tank.

Last bit of info - my ex had an '08 Touareg 2 with the 3.6 and I absolutely fell in love with it (to put things into perspective, it's got 105 more horsepower than the old V8 in the land rover! Plus a wonderful 6-speed versus the slugish 4-speed in the disco. Worlds apart. I loved the look/feel/integration in the cabin, even the famous Audi/VW "new car smell" - awesome SUV. However the guys at work have stated that they'd make fun of me if I got that over a Range Rover or something, so I think I'll combine the best of both worlds (looks-wise) and look at the Q7. I'm thinking '07 3.6 with the 20" wheel option and a slow upgrade to the '10 facelift.

The Range Rover Sport has great prestige, and I've found a few RR Sport Supercharged models for the price of the Q7 V6, complete with 390 hp and massive Brembos - but the mileage is simply disgusting (relatively speaking too - I know what to expect with a 5000+lb SUV).

Some questions are about the options - from the listings on autotrader, cars.com, etc, how can I tell if it's equipped with air suspension? How many V6s had this option? I've been looking for the button in the tailgate area but haven't seen one yet. :(

Also for the NAV, is this standard? All the Q7s seem to have the full-color dash and console screens, so the NAV was just a software thing? I'm used to the different trims of the Touareg I guess. Sunroof is usually an easy thing to spot, but what other options would be nice to get? Adaptive cruise? No chance in spotting that in a listing I guess.. and is the blindspot warning feature standard? Literature makes that one hard understand since it's listed as a safety feature, it almost sounds standard. Since most is integrated into the console system, it's tough to spot the options!


Sorry for the book guys, but obviously we know how important this decision is for a fellow car enthusiast! I really like the direction Audi is going lately, and would be a proud owner.

Oh it should be noted that I'd sell both the Discovery and Mustang for this (hence importance on the aspects listed above) :)

Only a couple of things IMO:

RR Sport is a Disco in a fancy frock and is nowhere near as competent off road as an actual RR (although its still pretty good :0) )

I looked very hard at RRs (several friends have them) before buying my Q7 (4.2 07 ABT, with just about every option), but in the end went for the it as my wife decided long ago that RRs look like London cabs. They also are quite limited inside space-wise - the back seat squabs especially feel short - the boot too - we have 2 Dobermanns and can (just about) get both dogs and a weekly shop in the back - with the RR it's one or the other.

Just my 2 cents :0)

1. Don't get me wrong, I've been loving the Q7, but if I didn't need a 3rd row I would have gone for the Cayenne or the RR (used Cayennes are crazy cheap right now).

2. The only tell tale sign of adaptive air is the button on the passenger side wall of the trunk area.

3. For Nav, you need to have the color screen between the odo and speedo. The non-nav cars had red and black monochrome screens.

4. You can tell if it has side assist by looking for a button with a red light forward of the driver side door handle.

5. For advance key (push button start and proximity door unlock) look for buttons rather than coin holders to the left of the gear selector.

Good luck!

Basically I'd like the best of both worlds - the image and performance of the Mustang, with the utility and off-road abilities of the Discovery. I'm not one of those people who will never use both extremes either - I fully plan on using the tow ratings and off-road features of anything I buy (disco has a 7700lb rating back in '99!) probably a 2-horse straight-load trailer, maybe a single car hauler, etc. I've got a lot of friends that live out in the back roads of a really nice town near me - some areas even have roads that cross creeks without bridges, and as the east-coasters know - we got 74" of snow last year in Northern VA. I'll be using that quattro to its' full extent.

Performance isn't really all that important, but the image is - the Discovery is nice, but at ~5400lbs with a 180hp V8, I'm THOROUGHLY sick of having everyone cut me off when lanes are engine, at every light, etc etc (even if I'm going the speed of traffic, the just wanna cut off the "box" in their way!) I'm pretty much helpless with that level of power in most situations where there are d-bag aggressive drivers, etc. Just kinda sit back and let it happen (and coming from the Mustang, that's VERY frustrating!) I do love the "go anywhere/do anything" feel of it though; it's a tank.

Last bit of info - my ex had an '08 Touareg 2 with the 3.6 and I absolutely fell in love with it (to put things into perspective, it's got 105 more horsepower than the old V8 in the land rover! Plus a wonderful 6-speed versus the slugish 4-speed in the disco. Worlds apart. I loved the look/feel/integration in the cabin, even the famous Audi/VW "new car smell" - awesome SUV. However the guys at work have stated that they'd make fun of me if I got that over a Range Rover or something, so I think I'll combine the best of both worlds (looks-wise) and look at the Q7. I'm thinking '07 3.6 with the 20" wheel option and a slow upgrade to the '10 facelift.

The Range Rover Sport has great prestige, and I've found a few RR Sport Supercharged models for the price of the Q7 V6, complete with 390 hp and massive Brembos - but the mileage is simply disgusting (relatively speaking too - I know what to expect with a 5000+lb SUV).

Some questions are about the options - from the listings on autotrader, cars.com, etc, how can I tell if it's equipped with air suspension? How many V6s had this option? I've been looking for the button in the tailgate area but haven't seen one yet. :(

Also for the NAV, is this standard? All the Q7s seem to have the full-color dash and console screens, so the NAV was just a software thing? I'm used to the different trims of the Touareg I guess. Sunroof is usually an easy thing to spot, but what other options would be nice to get? Adaptive cruise? No chance in spotting that in a listing I guess.. and is the blindspot warning feature standard? Literature makes that one hard understand since it's listed as a safety feature, it almost sounds standard. Since most is integrated into the console system, it's tough to spot the options!


Sorry for the book guys, but obviously we know how important this decision is for a fellow car enthusiast! I really like the direction Audi is going lately, and would be a proud owner.

We have an 07 3.6. It has many options, but no air susp/3rd row seating. The 3.6 is fine(we had a 4.2 Touareg before and the V8 is superior in power, but the transmission doesn't work well with it for some reason- same issue when I drove a Q7 4.2). You will find many here say the 280hp 3.6 is too weak for the Q with its 5100lbs to drag around(it only has 266ft/lbs of torque), but not me. I will tell you Audi's are not known for being trouble free. If you want that get an MDX. Ours just spent 3 mths in the shop with a roof leak. To your questions. The air suspension is pretty rare from what I have seen. Navi is an option, but many Q7's have it(it is in the Infotainment package). You may also want to look for cars with AMI(Audi Music Interface) as it allows seamless integration of an iPod into the stereo. Only cars built after 11/06 had the option. The Audi Side Assist is in the Tech package on 07's along with keyless entry/start(a very cool feature to have) and rearview camera. The Side assist is really helpful in the huge Q7. My wife doesn't want another SUV without it. I would want the following packs in an 07 3.6(Convenience-Homelink,power tailgate,bi-xenon,autodim mirrors,seat memory/Technology- Advanced park,Audi side assist,Advanced Key, voice operated systems/Infotainment-DVD nav, bluetooth). Make sure you try a 4.2 as well to make sure it isn't what you need.

BTW if yiou want to try something really cool - look for an older(04-05)Touareg with the V10 TDI motor. The power is completely off the wall.


Good luck.

Good luck!
Great info, thanks a lot! It's funny how people like us can pick up on the available options in those stupid autotrader listings by looking for certain buttons. I really just wish the dealers knew their sh** and would actually list them! Then again, I got a $1400 1000 watt sound system option in my mustang for free because the dealer had no clue it was in there :)


BTW if yiou want to try something really cool - look for an older(04-05)Touareg with the V10 TDI motor. The power is completely off the wall.


Good luck.


Thanks! I'm starting to get a feel for what I want/need (although it's going to KILL my trying to find the color combo I want with the options I need, which is also in semi-good condition and less than ~500 miles from me haha.

Oh and about the V6 - I drove the ex's around a bit and loooove it; has a very good power band and low-end torque. Oh and it sounds incredible! ..like.. better than the I6 in my M3 (I had a 97, which had snarl to it.. the 340hp '02+ sounded kinda strange to me). The 3.6 FSI has that sharp kinda "bark" to it, very mechanical and aggressive-sounding. I hope the Q7 is as loud as the Touareg 2! Well, at least the engine. :)

As much as I'd love the TDI 'treg, the older body style and interior have faded a bit for me (mostly because of all the cool stuff I loved on the ex's T2) and as you probably know, the early Touaregs were simply HORRIFIC maintenance-wise. Like significantly worse than any Land Rover. They fixed most of the issues quickly, but wow.. no bueno! :)

That's interesting about the side-assist feature, I wasn't sure if it was a gimmick or not!

I'm a little bummed about the air suspension, but I guess that is a gimmick ;) For towing it would be nice to avoid the rear "sag" but that represents 2% of what I'd use the thing for. Do you know if you could lower/raise it with the key fob? That's one thing I'm impressed that my 12 year old LR does! Makes hitching up trailers a breeze.

The sunroof scares me a bit too, since I'm dealing with that nightmare right now with the Discovery II.. except that's got an older interior in it. The thought of water inside that beautiful Q7 interior makes me wince! Can I pull TSB info to see if it's been performed on a certain vehicle yet? Is that the kinda info AoA would be okay giving out if the vehicle was listed as "for sale" and not under ownership?

Maybe I can post some listings I find in here and you can tell me what you think?

Oh and about the V6 - I drove the ex's around a bit and loooove it; has a very good power band and low-end torque. Oh and it sounds incredible! ..like.. better than the I6 in my M3 (I had a 97, which had snarl to it.. the 340hp '02+ sounded kinda strange to me). The 3.6 FSI has that sharp kinda "bark" to it, very mechanical and aggressive-sounding. I hope the Q7 is as loud as the Touareg 2! Well, at least the engine. :)

As much as I'd love the TDI 'treg, the older body style and interior have faded a bit for me (mostly because of all the cool stuff I loved on the ex's T2) and as you probably know, the early Touaregs were simply HORRIFIC maintenance-wise. Like significantly worse than any Land Rover. They fixed most of the issues quickly, but wow.. no bueno! :)

That's interesting about the side-assist feature, I wasn't sure if it was a gimmick or not!

I'm a little bummed about the air suspension, but I guess that is a gimmick ;) For towing it would be nice to avoid the rear "sag" but that represents 2% of what I'd use the thing for. Do you know if you could lower/raise it with the key fob? That's one thing I'm impressed that my 12 year old LR does! Makes hitching up trailers a breeze.

The sunroof scares me a bit too, since I'm dealing with that nightmare right now with the Discovery II.. except that's got an older interior in it. The thought of water inside that beautiful Q7 interior makes me wince! Can I pull TSB info to see if it's been performed on a certain vehicle yet? Is that the kinda info AoA would be okay giving out if the vehicle was listed as "for sale" and not under ownership?

Maybe I can post some listings I find in here and you can tell me what you think?

Understood. The Q7 is my wife's and I drive an 06 Z4M so I know what you mean about the engine. I like the sound of both power plants personally, but the Audi 4.2 V8 sounds infinitely better than either of the 6's IMO.

We actually had an 04 Touareg before the Q7 and I personally liked the VW's interior better(much more Land Rover looking to me). The electronics are better in the Q7, but that has been addressed in the Touareg 2 I am sure. The VW is also a more capable off roader if you are into that sort of thing.

The S/R TSB is not done unless you have a leak(there actually are 2TSB's for the roof- one for creaking at the front and one for a leak). They won't proactively replace the frame. You should, however, be able to get a printout of the service history of any car you are looking at. It may take some coercing, but it is available if you get the right person.

My $0.02:

- if you really want to do serious off-road then I'd avoid unibody construction altogether. If by off-road you mean dirt/gravel roads then you're fine with all the options you're looking at.

- Why not add Q5 to your list? Toureg doesn't have a 3rd row AFAIK, the Q7 could be a size up from what you need. The Q5 will certainly give you more of that responsive feel at the throttle and tighter handling on the road than the 7.

- I agree with the comments on Cayenne - I'd look at those too if you only need to seat 5.

I'd suggest going to your local Audi dealer and driving the Q7 and Q5. Probably there's a user or two here that's recently migrated from a 3.6 or 4.2 to the new 3.0T and can compare them for you. I guess where I'm going with all this is it sounds like you have a lot of competing needs (off-road capability vs on-road performance) which is natural given you're trying to combine two totally different vehicles into one! Knowing better where you're willing to comprise would help us give better insight from our own experiences.

I had an 07 3.6 and towed my Corvette to the track a couple of times. Works great. It had the 6600 lb factory tow package. Be sure to find one with factory tow. The add-on hitch is limited to 5500 lbs. The factory tow adds a tranny cooler.

A correction to the prior post about adding NAV. In 07, NAV was a part of the Technology package, which also had backup cam and Park Assist.

My 07 was a Premium, which included Bi-Xenon headlights and the MMI High multi color screen. Adding on NAV is quite easy. But it has to be MMI High. I added NAV with all Audi parts but used an aftermarket interior mount antenna attached to the rear hatch window sill. Most likely a non-NAV 07 Q7 does not have NAV antenna guts in the roof even if it has the shark fin.

The 3.6 is a torquey V-6 and you won't notice it weazing unless you are under heavy loads or trying to outrun Corvettes (uh I mean Mustangs) :-)

If you want to go offroad then the Q7 isn't the car for you... niether is the 2011 Toaureg (the new "Touareg2") I would go with the LR or find a 2009-2010 Toaureg TDI (the V6) with Air susp (very difficult to find.) Don't skip on Air susp if you really want to go offroad. There's always a 2008 Touareg V10TDI with AirSusp and a rear locking diff (this is my setup)... does awesome offroad and on... love the power of the V10!)

The new 2011 Touareg didn't get the 4.2 TDI or the off road gear (air susp, transfer case, locking diff) in the US... it's basicly a soccer mom car for the US market.

More interesting info, thanks guys..

Maybe I'm coming off more concerned about the drivetrain choices than I really am; I'm totally fine with the 3.6 and was very content with it in the T2 when I drove it around. These days with the 6-speeds, even a smaller engine like the 3.6 will be fine with towing, it'll just downshift / gear "hunt" a little more I suppose.

When I said offroading, I didn't mean I'd bring the thing to Moab and go rock crawling - sorry I didn't exactly make that clear. I meant off-road compared to the limitations of the mustang (aka.. uh.. speed bumps) haha. Seriously though, maybe some pretty nasty dirt roads, a few inches of water, and some of the nasty snow storms we get every now and then. Air suspension would be more important for me towing-wise than off-roading most likely.

Hmm, how can I tell if a Q7 has the tow package? Is the trans cooler visible through the grill?

Q5s would be nice, but they're still a little out of my price range I think (and the Q7 is just more of a "beast" vehicle) I understand it's slightly more limited off-roading due to its' wheelbase and front/rear overhangs, but still more than adequate for my needs.

gregtay - I might have to retract my previous statement about the 'treg 1. I test drove a V8 a while back (loaded with nav and air suspension) but they killed me on trade-in and I didn't have the time to sell my car private, so I just got the Disco. I'm STILL impressed with the interior of those things.. and I did a search a minute ago and found 2004 V10 TDI w/ NAV (was air susp. standard on those?) for 26,800 with 86k miles on it! The 04s had all those electrical issues though, so I'll have to see what was performed on it.

I will say that the air suspension implimentation on the 'treg is 1st rate, I especially like how it lowers the front air shocks when you open the hood so you can see inside easier, and that they give you an air hose hook-up under the pax seat to inflate the tires!


About the Q7; how common WAS the sunroof leak anyways?

Oh and Cayenne-wise, I really dislike the interior. For some odd reason it just goes against the other German / Porsche designs and almost looks child-like. I've seen many pictures where the button paint rubbed off everywhere, nothign wore very well, and all the lettering looked very informal/unrefined.

Oh aggie - I'm slowly starting to figure out the options/prerequisites for certain add-ons like the NAV, thanks haha!

More interesting info, thanks guys..

Hmm, how can I tell if a Q7 has the tow package?


gregtay - I might have to retract my previous statement about the 'treg 1. I test drove a V8 a while back (loaded with nav and air suspension) but they killed me on trade-in and I didn't have the time to sell my car private, so I just got the Disco. I'm STILL impressed with the interior of those things.. and I did a search a minute ago and found 2004 V10 TDI w/ NAV (was air susp. standard on those?) for 26,800 with 86k miles on it! The 04s had all those electrical issues though, so I'll have to see what was performed on it.

I will say that the air suspension implimentation on the 'treg is 1st rate, I especially like how it lowers the front air shocks when you open the hood so you can see inside easier, and that they give you an air hose hook-up under the pax seat to inflate the tires!




Factory Tow hitch (which is easy to recognize) is generally going to mean factory tow package... but my 2009 has the factory hitch that i added. Easiest way would be to look at the build sheet in the trunk and see if it has the code for tow package.

Yes, air susp was standard on a V10TDI Touareg.

The 3.6 is "ok" for towing.. not great, but if it's flat around you and your not towing a big trailer you would be fine. (I tow a 23" Wakesetter and i don't know how well the 3.6L would do.)

Air susp on the Touareg and the Q7 is identical.. i have it on both my Q7 and Touareg. Slightly differrent buttons to control it... but its the same system with the same parts and settings (because they are basically the same car.)

Factory Tow hitch (which is easy to recognize) is generally going to mean factory tow package... but my 2009 has the factory hitch that i added. Easiest way would be to look at the build sheet in the trunk and see if it has the code for tow package.

Yes, air susp was standard on a V10TDI Touareg.

The 3.6 is "ok" for towing.. not great, but if it's flat around you and your not towing a big trailer you would be fine. (I tow a 23" Wakesetter and i don't know how well the 3.6L would do.)

Air susp on the Touareg and the Q7 is identical.. i have it on both my Q7 and Touareg. Slightly differrent buttons to control it... but its the same system with the same parts and settings (because they are basically the same car.)

Haha okay I thought it was standard but I'm trying to remember some stuff from my Touareg learning-spree from a year ago. The ex was totally shocked when I showed her the AC vent in the glove box ;)


Anyways, as I stated before.. the older Cayenne body styles (pre-08) looked kinda dated, BUT I just found an '06 Cayenne Titanium Edition for 29,900 with only 33k miles on it. Probably one of those "porsche granny once-a-week" drivers :) Anyways the color and accents on this edition are stunning - totally compliments the "older" look of the cayenne and makes it really sleek.
06 titanium edition on net car show.. (literally looks like a German SUV version of my current car haha. Perfect :) )
http://img2.netcarshow.com/Porsche-Cayenne_S_Titanium_2006_800x600_wallpaper_01.jpg