<center><img src="http://www.jaktdepotet.no/bilder/Howa_HBSporter_PepperSS.jpg"></center><p>I really miss shooting since I moved out here to NY and want to get back into it. I don't have a ton of money so I was considering this Howa. Searching reveals mostly positive reviews...but of course, I would value your opinions. Stick good glass on it and it's ready to go? TIA.<ul><li><a href="http://www.snipercountrypx.com/pc-3361-1591-howa-1500-varmint-223.aspx">Few specs.</a></li></ul>
02-11-2008, 12:35 PM
I assume yer not in NYC, so you *CAN* get back into it of course....
02-11-2008, 12:43 PM
It has a lot of attributes that good, custom actions have. They're flat bottomed. They have integrated recoil lugs. The bolts, for the most part, are pretty smooth operating. The two things I don't like about them are their barrel and their latch on the bottom metal. I'll say this for them, they've come a long way from when they started producing rifles. Their quality has gone WAY up.
As for THAT rifle itself, I'm not crazy about bolt rifles in .223. Why buy a bolt rifle in that caliber when you could buy an AR that'll most like shoot just as well. I do like the laminated stock. The only thing I would do to it is bed the action and run in some good paste furniture wax into the barrel channel. This'll help protect the wood and keep it from warping.
02-11-2008, 12:49 PM
...that's in the included link. I believe the laminates aren't the most weather-friendly stocks...which I'd rather stay away from.
I'm up in Albany, BTW...so yes, it'd be much easier for me to go to the range ; )
02-11-2008, 12:53 PM
That said, a composite is of course gonna be the ultimate 'weather proof' stock, but I'm not really fond of their composite stocks. They're very flimsy, IMO.
02-11-2008, 01:07 PM
I think the bolt action is fine for me. I certainly won't be competing any time soon, so I don't think the cost of an auto is necessary. It would be pretty sweet, though =)
The Howa at the shop is the laminate, so I haven't had a chance to put my hands on their composite model. TY for letting me know about that as well. I'll have to dig around and see if anyone else is carrying them.
02-11-2008, 01:21 PM
First, they're usually pretty accurate. I've got 3 right now, and each one of them is a sub-moa shooter, out to 300, yards with nothing more than PMP commercial ammo. Second, they're very versatile. All you need to do to go from short to long is pop a couple of pins and swap out uppers. Third, acessories for the AR are usually cheap and plentiful. Fourth, 20 rouns mags. Now I'm not trying to sway you away from the Howa, it's a fine rifle, I'm just trying to point out the attributes of the AR as a system.
02-11-2008, 01:32 PM
Minus the scope.
Honestly, I'd love to have all the versatility...but I'll admit I'm not up to speed with the cost and availablity of all that.
02-11-2008, 01:40 PM
02-11-2008, 01:41 PM
Complete uppers are roughly half that. Keep in mind, if you shop around you can usually get one used for a lot less. Al 3 of mine were bought used and I've not had a single problem with them. Look at Rock River Arms, Eagle Arms, Armalite and Stag Arms. All 4 are great quality and should serve well. And the RRA has THE best OEM 2-stage trigger I've ever played with. They're super smooth.
02-11-2008, 01:50 PM
I'm spending money in my head already ; )
Occaisonally, I'll see ARs on the shelf at dealers but I'm always wary of their condition. This guy will say, "That's been set up perfectly with blah blah blah...", and, "So-and-so traded that in because he wanted to go 750+ yards but it'll still hit up to that.", etc. I don't know. Like I said, I moved out here (a few years ago now), and I don't know anyone that shoots or is interested in it like I am *shrug*. I don't want to walk in to a shop and have the guy try and pawn some toy off on me because he thinks I'm some kid (I may be flattering myself on that one) looking for a "machine gun". TBH, I would absolutely love to have a well-set up AR that I could take out and reliably shoot for years. The Howa was just a inexpensive way to get out and start hitting targets again. If I could find a decent AR all set up for less than $1000...I'd pinch pennies every day until I could get it.
02-11-2008, 01:55 PM
so I guess I'd suggest those just based on knowing him :)
No personal experience though.
02-11-2008, 02:04 PM
This is about the best thing to get started again. It's good enough to reach to 500 yards reliably, and beyond with a good scope, and it's very accurate. Not quite bolt-gun accurate, but it'll do nicely.<ul><li><a href="http://www.rockriverarms.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=category.display&category_id= 229">I have one with a 24" barrel...</a></li></ul>
02-11-2008, 02:17 PM
I don't have one...and I'm assuming it's not a passport photo, $20, and 15 minutes kind of a deal.
02-11-2008, 02:20 PM
...that sells RRA. Simple as that.
02-11-2008, 02:26 PM
He ought to be able to get you a better price than that too - based on what my buddy got....
02-11-2008, 02:32 PM
Alright. Time to hit the local dealers and see who's carrying RRAs. If I find a used one I'll check it out to the best of my ability and report back. This isn't going to be an extremely recent event, though. I had no idea I'd be able to get an AR easily...so I hadn't actually considered it until you came up with the suggestion. Ideally, I'd go this route over the bolt-action in a second...but like I said, it didn't seem like a realistic situation. Definitely looking forward to spring now =) The penny-pinching begins...
Just checked their dealer list and there's two shops in my area. I think I'm borderline too excited about that ; )
02-11-2008, 02:34 PM
Yeah...this is shaping up to be the way to go. I'm definitely going to be researching local dealers on what they're carrying and availability.
02-11-2008, 03:00 PM
IIRC, he mentioned them to his usual FFL and said he was ordering one with some online special direct from RRA. The guy said basically "If I can meet that price with tax included will you order it through me?" pretty soon my buddy had an order for 2 in and getting them out the door for less than the RRA special deal price....
I'm guessing his dealer sold near cost to get one (or more) for himself at that price.
02-11-2008, 03:03 PM
That'd be amazing, though.
02-11-2008, 04:18 PM
that is what I did with my last RRA AR and saved about $150 over buying local.
02-11-2008, 04:19 PM
02-11-2008, 05:53 PM
02-12-2008, 05:23 AM
Voorheesville, to be exact.
02-12-2008, 05:25 AM
That's a good suggestion. Hopefully this weekend I'll get out and check the shops to see what they have and what they're asking for them.
02-12-2008, 05:51 AM
my local place costs $30. Other places may be more or less expensive
02-12-2008, 09:02 AM
If you are looking for a gun to get yourself back into shooting I would go with a semi-auto. They're more fun and versatile. You can go out and just fire off a bunch of rounds at whatever you can find as a target to relieve stress or you can work on your accuracy.
02-12-2008, 09:05 AM
e-mail them for the links to actual prices. I plan to buy a complete upper from them in the next couple weeks.<ul><li><a href="http://www.adcofirearms.com/">http://www.adcofirearms.com/</a</li></ul>
02-12-2008, 09:56 AM
Do you have a range or club you belong to? Guest passes and all that? Utica isn't worlds aways, so it'd be worth a few trips for sure. I just have to acquire a nice rifle now! I'm now 93% leaning towards the RRA...so we'll see.
02-12-2008, 11:55 AM
My biggest problem has been finding one that does it all, shotgun, rifle, and here's the hard part indoor pistol range. I'll probably have to give up on the idea of pistol shooting in the winter. A friend of mine has access to plenty of farm land so that's usually where we shoot.
02-13-2008, 06:01 AM
I've seen 1:7 and 1:9. Now I see a 1:8. Do you have a preference?
It is my understanding that certain twist rates match up better with specific bullet weights. The .223 in 55 gr might work well with 1:9, but a 68 gr would be better with a 1:7. Or something like that. Am I right?
02-13-2008, 07:44 AM
02-13-2008, 08:31 AM
The 8 twist barrels are good for digesting most anything. Out of my RRA Entry Tactical, I usually shoot 55 grain South African commercial ammo (PMP). It's been more than accurate enough, usually under MOA when I do my part.
Another good example is my .260 match rifle. It's an 8twist barrel and will shoot 139/140/142 grain pills very nicely with a full load of powder in the case. The lighter stuff won't shoot as well unless I slow them WAY down.