what's the point? Garmin makes sweet portable units for a fraction of the OEM cost.

I mean, the A4 ain't a Chevy Tahoe, how hard is it to see what you're backing into?

The OEM Nav option just seems like pure marketing genius.

Garmin Nuvi and after-market GPS devices wipe the floor with both the Audi OEM Nav, the BMW Nav ('08) and in some cases even the Lexus and Acura Navs. This will always be the case IMHO.

However, where the Nuvi or TomTom or whatever will win in ease of use, UI, features, etc. they will always come second to integration and convenience for the driver.

Some examples:
- GPS signal strength and quality is 1000x better on OEM systems since they utilize the shark-fin antenna on the roof of the car.
- When in a tunnel, out of coverage, the OEM Nav's seem to calculate your progress by the odometer so it keeps you going. Best example is something like the Lincoln and Holland Tunnels between NJ and NYC. In my B8, it tracks me accurately IN THE TUNNEL whereas the Nuvi starts complaining about lost satellite reception and then takes a couple of seconds to pick up where you are at the other end. My B8 OEM Nav even shows me turning around in my parking garage!!
- When listening to music, OEM Navs will turn down the volume on the music when making voice guidance prompts. I love it and even my wife loves this. After-market can't do this as elegantly although I think if you wire it up to your head unit, it's possible.
- No matter where you place the aftermarket Nav, it obstructs part of your view through the windshield. Also have the power cord hanging off from it looks pretty crappy IMHO.
- Seeing turn/route information in the Driver display between odometer/speedometer is awesome. Hitting volume button on steering wheel to repeat last voice guidance is excellent too. Can't be achieved by any aftermarket Nav.
- Although Audi lags behind others in this, they're voice commands for the Nav are still better than none. Only the latest Garmin's have voice commands and they're close to $1k themselves! Audi has the essentials like saying "Special Destinations - next gas station" or "Last destinations" (it'll show a list) and then saying the # of the one you want. etc.
- Backup camera has limited utility for me but it's a nice to have and useful at night since the reverse lights provide a light for it, makes it easy to see behind you at night.
- The OEM Nav on the B8 seems to calculate and recalculate directions very very fast. Much faster than my Garmin Nuvi 780 and I thought that was fast.
- On my B8 I can navigate to any of the contacts I've loaded into the car's directory with little effort assuming I have their address in there. The Nuvi can't do this because although the BT on the Nuvi transfers the phone book, it doesn't transfer addresses.

The B8 Nav is not even close to perfect, and compared to competitors lags somewhat behind but I think the convenience and integration make up for a lot of its shortcomings.

B&O without nav doesn't sound as good due to the analog conversion.

in other words, can anyone reasonably tell the difference between all digital and analog DSP on the B&O system?

Besides, nearly all my music is in the non-HiFi AAC or MP3 format these days which I doubt is going to be improved by all-digital DSP.

In any case, these things still fail to add up to the $1K premium you're paying over a top-line Garmin unit.

I will concede that NAV probably makes resale a bit better, but since it's an Audi, you're gonna get fuxored on resale anyway, so that's probably a moot point.

I still feel that we're at the same point in time that CD players used to be in cars (where you paid an extra $600-1000 for a CD player while home players were $99). About two years later they became standard equipment (or really cheap) in cars.

I mean you can get NAV in many phones these days. The parts ain't that expensive.

So having the integration/convenience of OEM for an extra $300 or less is worth it IMHO.

i would rather spend the $1700 difference on a chip, 18" wheels, window tint, and ipod kit.

that's why I use my garmin also.. i love the fact that I can use it on any car i want. :)

that's a fvckload of cash for a backup camera, digital DSP, and the ability to see yourself going through a tunnel.

If all you want is a unit that can point you in the right direction, then a portable navi or even one of the phones with gps would do.

But if you want a unit that:

1. Is cleanly integrated into the vehicle aesthetics.
2. Is integrated to the radio to mute the radio to provide voice directions.
3. I don't have to worry about mounting and dismounting. (Hence, is always there, without worrying about "did I leave it in the other car?" or "I forgot the power cord".)
4. Is mounted "legally" where I can see it.
5. Etc.

The point is, there are certainly things that some people consider valuable and worth it than just using the unit to get from point A to point B. They may not be of value to you, but to others, these things add up to something worth the added expense.

On the other side of the coin the advantages of the Nuvi are:

- Touch screen is fast and easy (try setting a point on the OEM Nav map as a destination easily..); the OEM does have a nifty zoom feature via the MMI knob though.
- Has many more POI categories and subcategories i.e. stores, post offices (the OEM has only shopping centers and wine stores??)
- Traffic!
- More details are displayed in more zoom out levels (this one drives me nuts on the OEM- past 500 yds zoom level you lose most of the street details) even though the OEM has a larger screen.
- Portable - take it with you if needed at your destination or use in another car
- Speaks all street names for all directions
- Selectable voices and car icons
- GUI is generally more intuitive and mostly faster to operate, ie. spelling w/keypad vs. MMI knob select w/OEM

So....with both systems having their strengths, that's why I often use both together. (It's fun to see the often different routes the two choose for the same destination).

<center><img src="http://gallery.audiworld.com/albums/album286/A5070004_medium_001.jpg"></center><p>
If that's not perspective view, then it's a really weird city layout with street spread far apart close by and bunched up together further away.

Hear hear. That plus the backup camera made it totally worth it. Less nervous about wife's nervousness about parallel parking now :-)

the 2008 A5, A6, etc.? Do they have perspective view?

In overhead view, of course.

<center><img src="http://pictureposter.audiworld.com/43277/position3d.jpg"></center><p>Not sure if the setting location is different with MMI, but with RNS-E, you hit the SETUP button while in Nav mode.

You got me all excited thinking it was there and I hadn't noticed. Oh well.

<img src="http://pictureposter.audiworld.com/149949/img_0029.jpg">

<img src="http://pictureposter.audiworld.com/149949/img_0030.jpg">

Sorry, I should have been more clear in the last post. That was taken from RNS-E. And as I've said, I wasn't sure if it's the same with MMI.

I think Audi could've done everyone a big favor if they'd called it that. Even though the GPS unit may be "feature challenged", the Nav option and all that comes with it is a must-have for me.

The earlier posts have mentioned each of these things, but here's my take:

1) Dash layout: It's not just aesthetics but also ergonomics. When the controls are down by the armrest, they're literally at your fingertips. I really like that and will pay a lot for it.

2) Better (real) MMI: The real MMI gives you more digital (MOST), but just as significantly it also apparently functions better. Since the full iPod integration is a big selling point for me, the real MMI brings a lot of value. See this link for more info:
http://www.geocities.com/a6retrofit/articles/a4a5realmmi.html

3) Integration: I have a nice portable GPS unit in my B7 and it works great. But I find it messy and inconvenient compared to integrated systems in my friends' cars. Mobilehavoc did a great job of detailing all the various advantages of integration.

4) Back-up camera: If I had kids, I think I would really want this. I don't, but I do sometimes parallel park in the city. So for me, this is just a kinda nice to have.

Put those things all together, and the package becomes a must-have for me.

Just received my new Audi 2 hours ago, and there's an option called "3D" that turns on perspective view.