Just bought new A4 3.0 TDI in Switzerland. Car works well, but after using it for 1 month and driving if for 2200km, I really find it unsatisfactory. I believe this car is plagued with design faults which Mercedes and BMW probably avoided.

Ever since I obtained my driver's license, I drove a Nissan Micra, a 2.9l Golf synchro, an E36 BMW 325i, an E46 BMW 328i, an E46 BMW 330i, an 3.2 FSI Quattro automatic Audi A6, and now a B8 Audi A4 3.0 TDI. Of all the cars I drove, this is probably the one I am most dissatisfied with: while Audi made the car overall bigger on the outside, it is a LOT smaller than an A6 inside. Audi did not manage to translate the benefit of bigger outside dimensions into increased passenger space.

Suspensions are way too hard, and the adaptable chassis option is completely useless, as it does not make any difference if you use the auto, dynamic or comfort mode. These settings also affect engine response, which is really flat when using the comfort mode, adaptive when using auto and aggressive when using dynamic; the dynamic setting creates a hole between 800 and 1,600 rpm followed by a brutal acceleration up t0 4,500 rpm when above the turbo lag. The engine is just not progressive, which makes it really unpleasant to drive. In addition, the adaptable chassis settings also affect steering which goes from easy to really too hard - completely useless, I use the comfort setting all the time.

The engine made of vermicular cast iron is also approximately 100kg more heavy than the petrol version which affects the weight balance and therefore the handling; while Audi tried to correct the cornering capability with the new MLP platform, these improvement are lost with the heavy diesel and the car is still nose heavy, forcing you to pull the steering wheel in turn to keep the car in the trajectory in sharp corners.

While the dealer gave me a complete sales pitch about how the new A4 interior is better isolated from noise, it's absolutely not true, and I find the noise inside unbearable - you are still under the impression that you drive a truck (diesel engine again). At higher speeds 150kp/h the engine noise is just very present inside and makes a long journey a torture.
I have sport seats (leader and alcantara); the seating are is too narrow for me (100kg guy, 188cm or 6ft 2in) and hurts my legs after sitting in them for about 10 minutes. The steering column also occupies so much space in the leg area that I have to do some serious contortions to get in and out of the car. When driving, I touch the speed control lever (tempomat) with my left knee every time I press the clutch.

The garage remote control does not work and cannot be programmed, despite the fact that our remote controls are listed as compatible.
Good points for this car are : large mirrors, sunroof, 3D GPS system, and the B&O stereo. All the essentials are otherwise below my expectations; while you will understand that my standards and expectations are high, I just find it unacceptable that such major items were overlooked. I also compare with older cars, such as the BMW 330i, which I believe was superior in every aspect ranging from engine, interior space, handling and suspensions, and general comfort.

BTW, my girlfriend loves the car... I am going for a test drive of a BMW 335i next Saturday...

Jean-Luc

That's so unfortunate. Sounds like many of your complaints are due to the heavy diesel engine. I wonder how much of this translates for any of the US-available engines.

The engine is part of it. If you are a fairly big guy, watch the interior space before buying. I just find it a really crappy car overall; no way I am driving this for a long time, will sell it.

1) The A4 is NOT bigger than the A6 on the outside. It's just a bit smaller than previous generation A6, and significantly smaller than the current generation A6.

2) I haven't seen your sitting position, but if your left knee is hitting the cruise control lever, maybe you are sitting too far forward?

Not saying it's bigger than the A6. Just that the outside dimensions have increased since last generation A4 and that Audi failed to increase interior space taking advantage of this fact. I would think that the purpose of making it bigger outside is to offer more space to passengers?

Second, as to my driving position: moving the seat further back puts you in a really uncomfortable position, too far away from the steering wheel. Note: I don't have basketball player legs and midget arms...

First, thanks for your impressions!

-It's smaller than an A6, so yeah, it's not going to be as big inside as one. The reports I've seen indicate that there has been some growth in the interior, particularly in the backseat, and for myself - coming from the B5's junior sized rear seat any increase will be an improvement.

-A hard suspension and brutal acceleration sounds like a solid sales pitch to me.

-Vermicular graphite iron is a lightweight casting iron and the new 3.0TDI is supposed to be quite small - the entire engine only weighs 220 kg which makes it one of the lightest diesels in the world for it's displacement. I'm going to go out on a limb and say that a similar displacement V6 in gasoline trim won't be that much lighter. I've seen reports that the 3.2 gas V6 (with an aluminum block) weighs in at 170 kg (which is quite light as well). So at 50 kg more the 3.0TDI is hardly a porker.

-Your experience with truck-like noise is counter to Audiworld's testing experience. I'm of course very keen to try it myself and see. 150 kph is pretty damn fast, fast enough to get a significant amount of wind noise for sure. You're going to hear something at that speed, that's a given.

Hey Hokie Audi

Just a few comments to your commnent: what make a car pleasant to drive in terms of powertrain, is the fact that it's progressive and delivers power in a linear manner. It's just not the case with the diesel. This engine also has a pretty heavy turbo lag, probably 1 sec or so. The engine response is only good using the dynamic setting which dramatically increases throttle response.

Spec show that 3.0 TDI is 100kg more than petrol. That's fact, but I don't know if the difference originates entirely in the engine, or if other equipment also weigh on the scale.

I will conceed that my assessment of interior noise is not objective, as I never drove a diesel before. Nevertheless, fact remains that noise level is high (even doing 120kph) and it's not the wind; it's clearly the engine with a growling noise constantly present in the passenger space.

How do you define 'fairly big guy'? Are you referring to height or weight? I'm 6 foot 1 and I have adequate room in my B8 A4 both in front and back.......My legs don't come anywhere near the steering wheel as can been seen in the pics on my post "My new Audi A4 3.0 TDI S Line" The pic of the steering wheel was taken with me actually sitting in the front!

Plus my engine is not as noisy as you describe. I mostly do motorway driving & I've noticed a little interior noise in the cabin, although I do find the slight growl pleasing and it's in no way unbearable for me! Although I've not had it that long I hope that it continues the way it has so far.:-)

I guess some are going to like it and others not. All I can say to anyone else is take it for a drive and decide for yourselves (when it's available!lol):-)

I can't imagine the b8 being smaller. However, you may perceive it as smaller...

i think you would prefer a 1.8t with 17" wheels and standard non-sport suspension.

I believe that the Audi Drive Select allows you to program all the options you want between modes.

Maybe that's a US only thing. Not 100% sure.

After reading your comments, seeing that you test drove and compared quite a few vehicles...

You stated :

"Just bought new A4 3.0 TDI in Switzerland"

" Suspensions are way too hard, and the adaptable chassis option is completely useless, etc..after 10 minute drive your legs hurt, the car is not quiet at speed, and a host of other issues."

Good points for this car are : large mirrors, sunroof, 3D GPS system, and the B&O stereo

Please tell why you purchased a vehicle you didn't seem to want anyway, yet you're still out test driving other cars?

also the engine weights

219 kg = 482.81 lb TDI V6
169.5 kg = 373.68 lb
Diff 49.5 kg = 109.13 lb

Like all engines in Audi's new V-generation, the V6 TDI has extremely compact dimensions, engine length, for example, measuring a mere 444 millimetres. This is also an important step in view of achieving an overall engine weight of just 219 kilos, making the 3.0 TDI one of the lightest V6 diesels in the world. This benefits not only the car's power-to-weight ratio, but also the weight distribution - two factors crucial to the superior driving dynamics of the new A4 3.0 TDI quattro.<ul><li><a href="http://forums.audiworld.com/a5/msgs/6718.phtml">weight gas vs diesel</a></li></ul>

Perhaps you should trade it in for a new one that is not a lemon.

And, FWIW, Mercedes Benz has been building nothing but complete and utter garbage big time for the last eight to ten years.

A turbo engine, whether gasoline or diesel, will have that "bump" in power.

I've never seen anybody hit their left knee on anything on the steering column unless they are sitting too close. I assume you have already try raising and/or fully extending the steering wheel?

I have never driven a diesel car before so I cannot comment on the noise and power. However, I have been driving a 3.2q A6 the last 3 years and your assessment of the interior space is quite true to a certain degree. However, it is not fair to expect the space available in the new B8 to be comparable to the C6. The C6 is after all still much longer and wider. I have a 3.2q B8 on order and after sitting in a dealer's car I am fairly satisfy with the space. Although I am not as big as you I am 6ft and 210lb myself. I am also surprised to hear that the seat is too narrow for you, as they are the same for the TT, R8 and A4, and I have not heard any other bad comments so far. Maybe you should further re-adjust it.

and have not noticed any noise at all. RPM range was 2000-4000. What is the RPM at 160km/h - should be below 3000 at 6'th gear, considering 250km/h max speed and 4500RPM redline? Strange... They reworked injection to fight diesel "knocking", and inject 6-7 times per cycle rather than 1 time trucks do. And, according to my test, it worked. Waiting for 3.0TDI to test, must arrive in Q5 this fall.

I'm thinking 2.0t is the one to have.....clackety-clack doesn't work for me! I'll keep my weight down to have those seats ;)

If you want the room of the A6, why didn't you buy the A6? That's like being surprised that the room inside a TT isn't as much as an A3.

If the suspension is too stiff, then it still sounds like you need to be in an A6. That's the mid-size, semi-luxury, comfy model.

I've driven the B8s and personally think your assessment is a bit off-base.

Otherwise, his B8 A4 3.0 TDI would not have been the exact opposite of a dud and then some or a then a lot.

Plus, if parsifal_71's B8 A4 3.0 TDI was not a lemon, the engine in his car would have been much smoother than the 2.0T, most likely even smoother than a 3.2.

Apparently, I am the only one or one of the scarce few only ones who knows all of what I just said in this reply message that I just posted.

what does your girlfriend like about the car?

I've moved to looking at the A3 as I don't like the new A4. The Avant is simply too large. I loved the previous generation Avants, but this one is simply too big exterior dimensions. How pointless.

if you even have that car. Or have ever driven it... I somehow hear a bmw fan trying to make some conversation.

However, if you have the car, here´s my two cents.I´ve got a B8 myself, with a petrol engine though.

I´m a fairly big guy myself (190 cm, 100kg, ass not too big), but I sure don´t have any problems with the seat, or cruise control, or getting in and out of the car. My suggestion - adjust seat correctly. The steering column moves as well, so you should be ok in that drivers seat :)
What comes to interior space, it´s very hard to understand that you feel that an e46 is bigger... especially if you have a B8, that is...

I´ve driven a few 3.0tdi´s as well, but I´ve never noticed those symptoms you´re stating. Have you upgraded your ecu´s at the dealer? There are new updates available, which you definitely should get. I haven´t noticed signifigant engine noise at higher speeds, so I´m just wondering, if there´s something wrong with your car...

Even on 19" wheels there sure is a distinctive difference with suspension settings. Comfy is comfy (too comfy, I think), while dynamic is much more controlled. There should not be any holes in the torque range, so again I suggest getting those updates. You´ve had a few bmw´s in the past, so it´s kind of difficult to understand that you consider B8´s suspension as worthless. All the bmw´s if ever driven (many) are quite stiff too. Both are nice car, so no offence, anyone.
It however is true that in very sharp corners the B8 can understeer, but you´ll have to carry lots of speed to do that. At the same speed all bmw´s have initially understeered too, so...

Sorry about your problems, hope you get them solved.

there's still the nose heavy nature, higher purchase price and the US diesel prices to factor in (are we getting close to break-even on fuel expense?). Yeah big diesel grunt is great (though 4500 rpm redline) but let's get a well rounded comparison between the (new) 2.0t and 3.0tdi. :)

Any fairly big guy can fit even in the B7 with no problems (in the front). I am talking about myself and a lots of other people I know driving the B7.

So, if the B8 is bigger (it is!) what you are talking only make sense if "fairly" means "extremelly".

The 3.0 B8 was reviewed by quite a few mags already, none said anything similar to your opinions. Small complains, yes, not as fun to drive like x, but still a much improved Audi A4.

and man, you got to have a strange body. I specifically tried to adjust the seat and steering column in a way that my knee would hit the cruise control. Sorry pal, wasn´t even possible. No matter what I did, the first thing my knee would hit EVERY time was the steering wheel.

I also met up with my friend who´s got the 3.0tdi. We tried to hear engine noise (high speeds too, way over 200 km/h), but on a steady speed, no way. Under strong acceleration, of course, but then again you hear that in every car besides Bentleys as so on. But when cruising at 200 km/h, no. So, sorry again.

Yes, you may have a lemon but somehow I´m thinking that you are a bmw salesman. With a strange body :)

I've driven the Bluetec E320 and ML here in the US, and ridden in the current 530d in Manila. Grew up in Manila around a lot of diesel vehicles, and am well aware of old diesel shortcomings.

These cars had no audible clatter or much of an engine roar at speed. That made me skeptical of the OP's statements about noise. Even at WOT when merging, there is much less engine noise than one would expect. My Saab 9-2x (which is a rebadged Subie WRX) is a LOT noisier in that same situation.

Just keep an open mind. Granted magazine hacks aren't always credible, and we try to give owners a lot more credit, but let's wait for more owner opinions before whacking so hard on the B8. And for the guys that haven't driven new diesels, do try it out for yourself. You may be pleasantly surprised when you do.

We'll allegedly get the 3.0 in the Q7 first stateside, and then hopefully we'll see it in the B8 A4 shortly after. I'm just leery of AOA saying that the forthcoming disappointing 3.2 sales (how could they not disappoint compared to the quite nice 2.0TFSI) is evidence that American buyers don't want anything more than the turbo four. That's just the kind of head slappingly dumb engine strategy decision making I expect.

Sure you could argue that now you're not "paying more for less" as the EA888 2.0T crowd would say, but ultimatley the B8 A4 with 3.0TDI will cost more than an equivalent optioned 3.2. Combined with the hard sell of diesel luxury cars in the US and it doen't look promising for Audi diesel cars in the US. I'd think they'd concentrate on having them only in the Q5 and Q7 where they also won't sell as well as their petrol counterparts unless the consumer is given no option. (i.e. Q7 with 3.0TDI or 4.2 V8 only.)

I too would like to see Audi/VW diesels make a big move here in the US. But we're in the minority as far as AoA is concerned and marketing and general stigma of diesels still are not in a good state here in the US. It's kinda like the Avant lovers who scream and shout on the forums about how they are going to switch to BMW because they can't get a manual. When it honestly doesn't matter and AoA knows this because of the overall low sales of any Avant variety in the US.

I could unfortunatley see Audi going with fewer engine options in the US. Considering there will be the 2.0T, 3.2 , and 3.0T in the forthcoming S4 to add a fourth option of a disel or drop the 3.2 in place of it, or to offer the 290HP 3.0T doesn't sound like it will work well for AoA goal of a massive volume of sales.

And, the force fed gasoline V6 has SFSI and TFSI.

The force fed gasoline V6 is supercharged and not turbocharged or twin turbocharged, hence 3.0S and not 3.0T.

And, hence SFSI (supercharged fuel stratified injection) and not TFSI (turbocharged fuel stratified injection, regardless of whether it is single turbocharged or twin turbocharged).

And, yes, this engine gets 5-10 MPG higher fuel economy than the V8 in real world driving.

Hopefully (I am far from knowing the following for a fact, just like everybody else on Earth), this supercharged V6 in the B8 S4 will replace the gas guzzling V8 in the S5 when the B8 S4 comes out.

I can practically guarantee anybody that the piece of junk Mercedes C Class is any amount more fun to drive than the B8 A4.

However, my question remains, will the S5 ditch it's gas hogging V8 for this 5-10 MPG more fuel efficient (in real world driving, to boot) for the supercharged V6 once the B8 S4 comes out?

I dearly and sincerely hope so, as the V8, as wonderful as it is, is just to darn fuel inefficient where as the S/C V6 escapes the gas guzzler tax by a good margin with manual, Tiptronic and (if applicable) S Tronic transmissions.

Not to mention, the S/C (S/C being supercharged, of course) V6 has a 200 RPM higher redline than the R/A (R/A being regularly aspirated, of course) V8 with the same peak hp and torque but much grater availability of the peak hp and torque than the V8 has. The B8 S4 and, if applicable, the S5 are actually a little faster with the S/C V6 than with the R/A 4.2L V8. Basically, it is a win/win situation.

Does anybody here know if there is any possibility of the S/C 3L V6 replacing the R/A 4.2L V8 in the S5 when the B8 S4 comes out? If so, please share this knowledge with all of us AudiWorld members? Thank you dearly and sincerely in advance!

... probably jealous due to the new A4 testing better overall than the 3 series.

Especially the part about not fitting into the car. I'm 6 foot and I had lots of space in the B8, front and back when I sat in it. Maybe by "fairly big guy" in the description its referring to fat? That's the only way I could see someone having trouble fitting in those seats and the car.

I can't comment on how the 3.0L TDI drives, but it seems odd that in the Top Gear review a few posts down they recommended picking the 3.0L TDI over every other engine in the range. If anyone was going to notice and point out faults with the engine etc I would have thought it would have been Top Gear seeing as they are pretty good at picking out faults with any car.

Who knows, I guess we will have to just drive the car for ourselves.

I wonder if the new S4 engine will weigh more or less than the 3.0L TDI? Anyone have any ideas about that? I'm leaning towards saving up a bit more and getting the B8 S4. I calculated that a fully loaded A4 3.2L quattro wouldn't be far off an S4, (for Australian prices).

Fully loaded B8 A4 3.2L quattro tiptronic was ~ $120,000

A current tiptronic S4 is ~$130,000

Maybe the B8 S4 will increase in price, then again a manual S5 starts at ~$130,000 so the sedan should be less technically, especially in manual.

I think you hit the nail right on the head. parsifial_71 is a full blown troll.

Should we just tell parsifial_71 to get the steppin' from AudiWorld?

Why did you rent (lease) this car? Everyone with half a brain knows that the 3.0TDi is more nose heavy and less sporty on mountain roads.

Je pense que vous devez faire examiner votre tête. Obtenez la BMW 335 et ne revenez pas ici.

I listened to that 2.0tdi in an A6 Avant on youtube and it clacked and tapped like a son-of-a-gun! Now, mind you, this was from the outside of the car and perhaps it was cold? It still sounded like a cheap little Asian box truck :-o

a diesel by nature will NEVER be as quiet at a n/a motor. And the more cylinders you add, the quieter and smoother the engine is. So I'm not sure if the OP was expecting it to be as quiet as say an A8 with a 4.2 or what.

Shocking suggestion I know but there you go..........

I'm not letting mine go!;-)

in other words.... if having a beautiful whisper quiet motor was important, would you buy a diesel?

At full wail it's barely audible compared to the gasoline powered cars. By all accounts the TDIs are remarkably quiet, even more so than their gasoline brethern.

<ul><li><a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YMBkiwvQ7v8">Youtube: 2007 A6 2.0tdi</a></li></ul>

As everyone seems to think I don't have half a brain, I send you an independant review of the A4 by reasonable journalists... They just happened to come to the same conclusions as I did.<ul><li><a href="http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/Drives/Search-Results/First-drives/Audi-A4-30-TDI-SE-Quattro-car-review/">http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/Drives/Search-Results/First-drives/Audi-A4-30-TDI-SE-Quattro-car-review/</a</li></ul>

Really guys, if you have decided to remain blind for the rest of your lives because you are fans, your problem. The A4 is a disaster, see post from independant journalists who just found the same as I did...<ul><li><a href="http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/Drives/Search-Results/First-drives/Audi-A4-30-TDI-SE-Quattro-car-review/">http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/Drives/Search-Results/First-drives/Audi-A4-30-TDI-SE-Quattro-car-review/</a</li></ul>

Its not like you've been a long standing member of the forum. Your review might have more credibility if you have been around for a while. Obviously you made an account on here for the sole purpose of spewing your dislike for the car. Audi is not for everyone, on the same note I'll sooner buy a Hyundai before I ever buy a BMW.

Many of us that have seen the car, been in the car and driven the car highly disagree with your assessment of it. If its really that much of a displeasure for you to own, then by all means SELL IT!

WYF am I here? I am here to make people aware that buying current A4 B8 equals buying junk. Whether you like it or not, I am posting my independant views on the qualities and design faults of the car. I believe my opinion is built on actual facts, and driving experience.

Again, if you don't like it and just refuse to see reality because you have decided to stay blind as an Audi fan, then stay blind...

BTW, no doubt I will sell it. I told the dealer already, the guy was so disapointed... And told me to contact him such as he can propose to sell me an other Audi!

Audi? Never again!

bimmerforums.com is kindly awaiting your arrival. I'm sure your new BMW will be the perfect and flawless driving machine that will never have a single issue in its millions of miles.

I find it interesting that the OP didn't actually post anything worthwhile in his comment on that page, other than a link to this thread.