<ul><li><a href="http://magazine.windingroad.com/windingroad/200801web/?pg=97&amp;pm=1&amp;u1=friend">link</a></li></ul>

Not bad... 3484 for the A4 3.2.

Steering."

That is a great statement right there

In this case, learn from other's mistake and improve on it!

I'm in love already. If we really do end up getting Turbos on the S4... oh man. The wife and I have had 5 Audi's since 2000. Was about to look into a 335i ( I know, the dark side ) but all this B8 news is driving me carazy! :)

-Brian

Only 0.3 second improvement from the B7's 6.7 second time is hardly earth shattering. The closest slowest current competitor is the MB C350 Sport which does 0-60 in 5.8-5.9 seconds. The rest of the field (G35, IS350, 335i, etc.) are at least a second faster.

Yes, 0-60 is not everything but for a brand new model to bring up the rear is not a good distinction. It's a shame since everything else about the car looks really good. Hopefully by summer 2010 when my Bimmer lease is up, they will have upgraded the V6 engine. I definitely want to come back to the brand. I like my BMW a lot but miss the neat Audi interior touches.

as it will offer the performance and mileage. Plus, being a turbo, power increase will be easy.
The dynamic steering does work well as I remember it well when I test drove the S5.

I ask because I have a brochure sheet for the B8 A4 and it claims a 0 - 100km/h of 6.1 seconds in the 3.2L V6 and 6.0 seconds in the 3.0L TDI.

I'm not sure if they were using an automatic in their tests either which is always slightly slower than a manual.

I think I would get the 3.0L TDI, seems the best engine at the moment, and its available where I am. Has anyone test driven a 3.0L TDI against the 3.2L V6? Would be an interesting comparison.

341 pounds less than 335xi(3825). Great.

With either a supercharger or bi-turbo, B8 S4 will kick some butts.

Count me in with a 3.0TDI or 2.0TDI in the B8/A4 range! Audi of America, RUN, don't walk to the emerging diesel market in North America. The BMW 3.0 twin turbo diesel is a formidable competitor, as the 3.0TDI is no slouch......Bring in da noise! (read torque)

Couple my B8 TDI with a 7sp DSG = killer comuter sled or sled, period!

The 3.2 would be smoother but with a small difference in HP over the 3.0, (240 vs 265). The TDI will have a huge difference in torque so the 3.0 TDI should perform better.

Either way, if the B8 S4 gets a supercharger or twin turbochargers (but not both), the V6 (hopefully-I am far from speaking factually here-hence the use of the work hopefully-a Porsche 3.5L V6 instead of an Audi V6) B8 RS 4 will most likely-but not definitely-hence the use of the words most likely-get both a supercharger and twin turbochargers for the same engine, which would be a triple-charger.

It is like VAG's twin-charger which has a supercharger and a turbocharger for the same engine. Only a triple-charger, again, would have a supercharger and twin turbochargers for the same engine.

If not, then Winding Road will definitely like the A5 and S5 this much or more with the Audi Drive Select Systems when it becomes available on those cars.

I thought I heard somewhere that diesel engines can become dirty and clogged up (this info is most probably wrong).

I think that the main question is; is there any point in getting a 3.2L V6 petrol engine over a 3.0L TDI, and from what you have put in the heading to your post, it seems that the 3.0L TDI is superior in every single way . Is that what you think? Would there even be any point looking into the 3.2L V6 if the 3.0L TDI was available e.g it is in some countries.

The 3.0L TDI costs the same as the 3.2L V6 petrol engine too, from what I can see being offered in my country at the moment with the B7.

I have owned 3 older style diesels in the past and they were bullet proof, (Mercedes Benz). New generation diesels are that much better and enhances performance and economy.
For the most part, changing filters and oil is the maintenance on diesels.
Personally, I think the 3.0 TDI is the engine of choice over the 3.2 gas. Reasons:
1). More torque/power
2). Longer life
3). Much better fuel economy
4). Less maintenance, (not a big deal)
5). Tuneability- Since this is a turbo diesel, software upgrade to enhance performance is a simple as plugging into one's data port and re-mapping software.

Now, the 3.2 offers a smooth engine. Efficient and quite. Fuel is easier to get then diesel, (for now in US). So, both engines have good points. But I think the 3.0 will be the leader by far. In fact, they have re-mapped the 3.0 TDI on a test track and have beaten the S5 by 1 second...

This matched up with BMW's old lineup of

325, 328, 330, M3 from '07

BMW dropped the 325 for '08, and now has
328, 335, and M3 only for '08 in the U.S., conversely Audi is introducing entry level 3.2v6 first, in the U.S. which will compete with 328. They may bring the 2.0t, over, but the S4, will go up against the 335, and will drop the V8 and get a v6 with forced induction twin turbos or supercharger. The RS 4 will keep v8 and get twin turbos, or get the lambo / s6 v10. Doubtful they'd drop the RS4 to v6 because, it will be extremely expensive to get the expected 450 - 500HP out of a v6, that the RS 4 will need to outdo the e92 M3.

Just like the B8 S4 could just as easily go V6 supercharger as it could go V6 tt (oddly enough, 3L and not 3.1L or 3.2L).

The B8 3.2 FSI V6 actually puts out 265 HP and not the 255 HP stated erroneously in the article.

*rolls eyes*

-- I love my 4.2 allroad. But I cant stand the 15mpg average and the visits to the gas station every 4-5 days. Really hope a TDI avant becomes available in early 2009. Love the new body style -- even if it does scream "bimmer" to my eye...

The E90 328i (230 hp) replaced the 325i (215 hp) after only 1 year. The same thing happened to the 330i. There is no 2007 330i, only the 335i. These are of course for the U.S. market which is what we're tsalking about.

The 3.0L TDI does seem like the engine of choice. I live in Aus so diesel is easily available and TDIs have been around for ages. The 3.0L TDI keeps looking more and more attractive.

Do you think as well that the 3.0L TDI engine gives a more sporty response seeing as you said it isn't as "smooth" as the petrol 3.2L V6? If so then I think thats great, a 3.0L TDI S line would be perfect.

As someone has posted above a few threads an interesting choice in cars would be the 3.0L TDI S line or S4. What would you choose, out of interest?

and Mercedes has dropped SC form just about all of their options... too much unmanaged heat and hp loss.

Does the A4 3.2l compete against the cars that I just mentioned? No matter how you slice it the A4 will be the weakest performer in its class. 0-60 in 6.4 seconds? My 2001 330i does better than that.

I wouldn't count on any significant weight loss. The new model is considrably larger in size, so the best I am hoping for is that it hasn't packed on any additional weight.

Performace-wise the A4 3.2 competes well against the C300 and 328i, but the problem is that it will priced above the 300+ hp G35 and IS350 and very much in line with the 335i and C350.

Audi must be hoping that people will pretty much disregard engine power and be totally seduced by the exterior/interior and the mechanical improvements (weight distribution, smaller front overhang, etc.).

In fairness, the quoted 0-60 time of 6.4 is for the Tiptronic, not the 6MT. Still, it remains to be seen if or when AoA will offer the more responsive 6MT version. They botched the B7 3.2 launch by offering the Tip version only for the first several months.

Havn't you seen that its the 3.0L TDI thats the talk of the town these days. So the 3.2L isn't as good as some of the other cars, the 3.0L TDI will easily compensate. The only thing that you can complain about the TDI engine is that it isn't available where you are (for now). Apart from that the engine seems excellent.

Why can't Audi build a competitve regular fuel engine for the A4? Just like the competitors are doing with their competing cars.

Where I am the B7 A4 is already available with the 3.0L TDI and it is exactly the same as the 3.2L. This may be different for you in the US but I think its a bit slack if they do that over there while leaving it the same as the 3.2L in other countries. True as well with moving over to a diesel engine. Everything about it sounds perfect but theres just something that makes me think "I'd still rather a petrol". I don't know why, and I think other people get this feeling too. Its probably because its something thats relatively new (in cars, especially as its not out yet in the US as well) and people are always a bit reluctant to go for something new.

I suppose Audi wants to be the leader in diesel engines as well seeing as they built the R10 etc. Maybe thats why they are shifting their focus away from petrol, putting more funds and research into TDI.

I don't see why the 3.0L TDI can't compete with other cars in its class though. I think the TDI engine will be great from what people who have driven it say.

Honestly though I would rather the 3.0L Bi Turbo engined S4. You probably prefer that engine and car too don't you? Problem is that it costs significantly more than the 3.0L TDI.

the only A4. And it's just as fast as it's intended competitor in the U.S. the BMW 328, and G35, IS 250, C280.

You wish that the 3.2 was the base model in the US. That way you can put it up against the lowest BMW, MB or Lexus offering and it would stand a chance of competing. But the 3.2l isn't the lowest A4 offering in the U.S, the 2.0t is.

The 3.2l A4 Does not compete against the Lexus IS250, C'mon dude.

You are saying that the A4 3.2 competes against the lowest offering from Lexus, BMW, and MB. If that's the case then what vehicles does the A4 2.0t compete against?

However, I am convinced that I know what I want.
The S4 will be a great car and fun to mod and it will run, (my predictions is the new S4 with a few mods will out run an RS4) I said it about a month ago and see this engine producing lots of power.
However, the car of my choice will be the 3.0 TDI S-Line as it makes the most sense for me as I drive a lot. Since I use this car for work the extra $$ the S4 costs doesn't make sense, (fuel or cost of car) driving 40-50K per year. The diesel will last 300+ thousand miles and I will have saved, (on average 4500 gallons of fuel or aprx $15,000 in 300K driving the diesel.

Like I said in comparison to BMW 3 series, the 3.2 is the base model,

BMW was 325, 328, 330, M3, which compared to A4
2.0t, 3.2 (then 3.0), S4, and RS4.

The line ups do not compare any longer. as BMW dropped 325 in the U.S, and only has 328, 335, and M3.

The Audi 2.0t no longer has BMW counterpart.

I still think I will long for an S4. I'll just have to see how things go in the next few years and how Audi goes about this new S4 with pricing etc.

Who knows, you could win lotto tommorrow. Anythings possible.

E90 325i and 330i were only sold as a 2006 model. For 2007, they got upgraded engines and changed to 328i/335i.

By the way, I still disagree with you about the competing vehicles. Here are my match-ups based on primarily price, followed by engine power and cylinder count:

A4 2.0 T against 328i/C300/IS250
A4 3.2 against 335i/G35/C350/IS350
S4 slotted sbove 335i but below M3
RS 4 against the C63 AMG, V8 M3 and IS-F

The ?400 lb weight loss (don't remember) and SIX-INCH wheelbase gain seem to be huge improvements.

So maybe I'll just bide my time with something older until I can get a proper B8 Avant in the US. In the summer of 2009, right?

And slated to make 335HP. Obviously, they intend it to be compared against the 335.

At the end of the day this is stupid argument, I know what I'm buying, I know what I like, I know I prefer Audi, and as long as they continue to make beautiful cars, with excellent performance, and gorgeous exteriors and interiors, quality components, that's not going to change. That's not to say other manufacturers like BMW don't make great cars, they do, they just do nothing for me. I don't like BMW interiors, I don't like that every other car on the planet is a 3-series, it just doesn't move me. I can't wait to get my S5 and you could compare it to whatever makes you happy, and you know what, short of an Aston Martin, it's what I would purchase, and even then, I still prefer the S5, of course. Power wise, RS5 is going to be at least minimum to compare to Aston Martin, but here sums up my thought, I'm buying the S5 because it's what I want. For your comparison, I don't care that you can get a 335 for less and you can mod it, or for that matter in your comparison an M3 for a little bit more, I just don't want those cars, get it. It's not about saving a few thousand dollars, or spending a couple more for a fraction of second speed, or this or that, what's ultimately important to me, is what I want. And these price ranges I'm going to get what I want, if I was concerned with pricing, or squeezing every last ounce of performance, I wouldn't buy any of these cars. The equation is larger than X's and O's.

Most people put a limit on the premium they are willing to pay for the car of their dreams. If an A8 costs $400/month more to lease than a 750i because of lousy residuals, you can bet that Audi will lose a lot of sales (as evidenced by the recent slump in A8/S8 sales of 25% year-to-date compared to a year ago). This is not about what you as an individual would do. It's about Audi selling cars and being competitive in the marketplace.

By the way, the S5 is an absolutely gorgeous car and worth a premium over a 335i coupe. But since an A5 3.2 S-Line looks virtually identical to the S5, I assume that one of the main reasons you're opting for the V8 S5 is the extra oomph that is lacking in the V6 version. I suspect that if the A5 3.2 had an engine that put out 30 more horses, you would have stayed with the V6 which presumably wouldn't get hit with a gas guzzler tax.

As for being in the minority, ok, ... this is my rational say you like brunettes and smart women would you get a women that dies her hair black and looks smart? Or would you got out and try and get a brunette who is smart.

That's my point. I don't think I'm in the minority, to be honest, I think people want what they want, the A5 3.2 S-Line looks very similar to an S5, all audis in a family look alike, the RS4 looks very much like an A4, and it's one of the reason I like Audi. Unless, you know Audi you wouldn't know the difference, it's part of the stealth, and I like that. I don't want everyone to know there is a V8 sitting underneath the hood, I enjoy the reaction when they can't keep up and they ow so thought they could. That's what makes RS 6 Avant so tantalizing, a station wagon with near 600HP, how arrogant, can you be.

if the v6 came in at 295 or 300 hp, i'd still buy the S5. I prefer the V8, why because, larger displacement means more smoothness less effort, less whine in the engine sound, more throat, and effortness in acceleration.

As for the A8/S8 sales, I doubt the reason why sales are slumping have anything to do with it's premium cost, and alot more to do with market conditions, economy, age of platform, people buying smaller cars for a greener earth, gas prices, etc ..., the A8/S8 have never been a huge seller to begin with. I don't think you get it, I don't want the 750, even if it's cheaper, I don't care especially in the price range, 400 - 500 less, I don't want it, I'm fine. Either way, like I said before, by what's appropriate for you, I'm quite content with my choice, actually I'm ecstatic and wouldn't have it any other way, except of course Drive Select, Magnetic Dampeners, and Hill Hold assist but alos we in the U.S. are denied this until next year. More over, I'd pay to have them, of course, I'd take them free though to.