So, I saw in a few threads that people are complaining about the availability of the S5, and wait times:

Loaded S5 in USA US$: ~63,000
Loaded S5 in Germany US$: ~107,271

I tried to not equip the S5 in the German configurator with stuff unavailable on the US market, there were a few things that would have put the car closer to $120,000 if totally loaded.

The base S5 in Germany comes with cloth seats and no sunroof, just for starters ...

The S5 has a 6 month wait period in Germany (they don't need to ship to a harbor, then load it onto a boat, bring it to the US, unload etc).

Given that Audi can make a lot more money selling the car anywhere but the US, the wait time being about the same as in Germany (the home market), I think there is nothing out of whack. Maybe Americans need to learn patience - given that they only pay 59% of the price I think that's reasonable.

Why are people so whiney these days? Between here the B8 A4 forum i'm going to need a lot of cheese!

I do agree that people should be more patient, though. Bozos paying over sticker help no one. But it doesn't excuse Audi for having such a long wait time for any market.

Things just feel so much more intense and good when you have to wait a little....

... with an emphasis on "DEMAND"...

Right on- I think Audi hit it out of the park with this car- along with the R8 (the 5 being a little more reachable to more consumers than the 8). Because of that, everyone wants it.

This is a hot car everywhere; not just the US. Wait times, i'm sure, are higher than normal in all countries.

Perhaps someone in Germany can answer this- do these price differences (US$ to US$) include taxes? I read that German tax on a new car can be 16% (and higher, based on engine size)? Not that it explains the diff in prices, but could be some of the differential...

There is absolutely nothing wrong with paying over sticker. If you don't like it, you simply don't buy it. It's that simple.

Let me ask you this... if YOU were a dealer with a hot car on your hands, and the M "S" RP was 60k, and you had buyers coming in willing to buy it for 65k, what would YOU do?

Also, it wouldn't matter if the dealer marked it up and the buyer agreed to it, or if buyers were bidding it up. If that is what the car is worth, than so be it.

As for Audi excuses, sure they can have one- they're making more money on the car elsewhere in the world ("longer" wait times in the US), making more money on other models---maybe they just flat-out underestimated the demand on this car.

And i'd bet that if any one of us that owns an S5 sold it right now would get "more" for it in resale% than one would expect.

thinks that an American's first act is to SUE, or invade their home country..

Nice stereotyping...

I don't blame the dealers selling above MSRP, as long as they're not requiring it. There's a difference between:

A. "You want to pay over sticker to have the car sooner? Sure!"
and
B. "We won't be selling any A5/S5's at or below sticker."

"Worth" is a tricky concept. Let me reword my statement:

People who pay more than MSRP drive up perceived demand for this car, and all that does is drive up prices until supply exceeds demand, at which point resale will implode.

Yes, Audi has excuses, but my point is none are valid.

This car is a hit, pure and simple. More people want the car than there is avaialability. They miscalculated the consumer response. Or, maybe they didn't, and this is part of the grand Audi sales plan for the next 5 years---to build a frenzied demand on really good cars...which is really not a bad approach.

To me, that is valid (opinions are opinions, and your are just as warranted as mine, respectfully).

As for perceived demand, A is demand-based logic, and B is supply-based logic. If a dealer "required >MSRP," one of two things will happen: noone will bite, thus he will eventually reduce his price, or he will find a buyer at the markup price.


people are wanting to buy it now, thus it is determining its worth, or value. You may think the price is too high, but others are willing to buy it at a markup. Good ole' capitalism.

Why do you think the value of gold, platinum, stocks, etc. go up and down? This is no different.

Here's food for thought... if this car is THAT good, why wouldn't someone pay a little more than the "suggested" retail price for it now to get want they want, and still be less than the M3 (which is more--- not trying to hijack the thread with an S5/M3 debate)?

Also, would many be complaining if this car theoretically MSRP'd for 10k less than what it does now, and the dealer marked it up 5k? You bet they would, because many feel that they were getting jacked.

A car is simply worth what you are willing to spend to get it, if you are buying it to drive/keep it.

As for markups, i can drive by the local BMW Store, and drive by 12 M3's with markups on them, and noone is buying them at that price. Why? suppply and demand.

It's all too evident that lawsuits are out of control these days... There are far too many class action lawsuits in this country. If only the general pupulation could take responsibility for their actions instead of always blaming others. My favorite is the person that sued McDonalds because they were overweight, Or the more recent class action lawsuit against Apple because they are unhappy with the download speed of their brand new iPhone 3G. I guess returning the phone and getting something else would be too easy.

IMO the mentality to sue for everything hurts us all. Obviously it's not everyone but there are too many people that think it's the way to get rich while they wait for that magical lottery ticket win. (/rant)