We have just bought two Q7s in Greece and can say that we are very disappointed with the whole experience.
We investigated a range of alternatives; Cayennes, MLs, GLs, X5s ... and whichever car we decided on we (in Greece) have to pay a 50% + 'environmental' tax for any vehicle with over 2000cc. We then investigated all alternatives, ordering from Gremany and driving it down etc but no matter how we did it, if we wanted Greek plates we would be subject to this tax. We accepted it and decided on the Q7 cos it is a damn fine car and has 7 seats (important for us).
Got price for 2 cars and specs as follows:
Q7 3.0 TDI Quattro Tiptronic - Euros 64900
S-Line Exterior Package - Euros 2700
Lava Grey - Euros 1700
Olive Wood Package - Euros 550
Cricket Leather: Beige Kardamom - Euros 3100
Navigation System with DVD - Euros 4200
Bluetooth - Euros 1000
Bose - Euros 985
20" 5 spoke parallel alloys - Euros 3350
Adaptive air suspension - Euros 3850
Electronically retractable towbar - Euros 1460
Spare tyre with compressor - Euros 120
Side and back tinted windows - Euros 550
Back airbags - Euros 500
Double center comfort arm rest - Euros 230
Gear lever in wood - Euros 150
Xenon plus light system - Euros 1270
Total per Vehicle Euros 90345 x 2 = Euros 180,690
Now i bet you feel like you got a good deal!
So after being screwed on the price we then had to wait for 4 months for delivery. My dad went to pick the vehicles up today, he calls me all excited and happy that everything looks fine, until ...
He asks the dealer where the two back seats are. The dealer says we ordered the 5 seater. Now from the literature i read before placing the order i was under the impression that the vehicle came as a 7 seater (standard) and 6 seater (optional extra).
So after paying rediculous amounts for the vehicles we only end up with two 5 seaters.
What i would like to know is
1) Is this true? Does the car come as a 5 seater in its standard form. If so then i am entirely to blame. If not there will be hell to pay, and somebody will pay.
2) We have two 5 seater Q7s is there anyway we can have the extra 2 seats installed at this stage. The Greek dealership are not sure and are entirely incompetant!!
By the way, awesome forum. Although it is my first post i am an avid reader.
01-19-2007, 04:16 AM
dealer would go through the order (especially since you're buying two) to ensure all of the details were correct before ordering.
My first guess is that it's unlikely the 5-seater can be converted into the 7-seater.
I think JustForFun (or was it his friend?) ordered a 7-seater and he received a 5-seater. Audi re-ordered the car for him and he kept the 5-seater until the new one arrived.
Really sorry to hear about the confusion.
I'm assuming you really need the 7 seats or this wouldn't be a big deal. The back row is VERY small, so unless it's for children, I wouldn't count on getting much use out of them. I have yet to even see mine up.
01-19-2007, 04:44 AM
5 seat configuration standard on 3.6
7 seat configuration standard on 4.2
6 seat configuration standard on 4.2Premium
7 seat config can be ordered for 3.6s and 4.2Premium, 6 seat config can be ordered for 4.2 This is all from memory, so someone please correct me if I'm wrong.
01-19-2007, 05:35 AM
if you wanted to get the 4, 6 or 7 seater. As I recall from the ordering catalogue these specs where considered extras and involved some additional cost. I am not sure a retrofit is possible and not sure you 'd want a dealer in Greece performing that... I am pretty sure you specified it and the dealer screwed up (I am from Greece...) and bought one of the first 4.2 last year so i can associate with you..
01-19-2007, 06:00 AM
Finally found one of the earlier threads discussing it -- the floor plans are different for 2- and 3-row configs and 6-/7-seat configs.<ul><li><a href="http://forums.audiworld.com/q7/msgs/7302.phtml">Earlier Link</a></li></ul>
01-19-2007, 06:55 AM
Thank you all for your feedback
The actual events leading to this mistake are more complicated than might appear at first glance:
Although i can almost speak Greek fluently i am far more comfortable reading English and it would probably have taken me an entire day to read the Greek brochure for the Q7. So the dealer sent me a Greek brochure and an English brochure.
Being somewhat of an impulse buy (never having visited the dealer, test driven the car or even seeing one in the flesh) my order was based entirely on the Engligh brochure i received and any English literature i could find on the web. Being half British i have to confess to also consulting the Audi UK website as the Greek website had no English translation.
So it turns out, as Krokas quite rightly states, the standard Greek specification is 5 seats, whereas in the English brochure and in the UK 7 seats are standard. Completely unrelated but, it is also pleasing to see there is somebody who can associate with the frustrations of doing business in Greece, people are fantastic and country has endless potential but disorganised.
Anyway, having seen the seven seat layout decided that last two seats are of little use and it turns out they can be installed at a later date at a cost of E2,500 + labour. Bit concerned as to how this might effect resale, but for now who cares.
01-19-2007, 08:47 AM
I have the 3rd row on mine, and have yet to really use it. I do put them up every so often just to see it.
01-19-2007, 09:09 AM
Hi, sorry to hear what just happened to you. In my case Audi GMBH as it is S-Line. I very scecifically ordered a 7 seater and sent emails to question the 2nd row configuration. They initially suggested I ordered wrong but then put their hands up and agreed that there had been a mix up in reading specs sent to them.
I said i would accept retrofit of the third row seats but they said the car has a different floor pan so not possible. Also I believe there might have been a problem with seat belt anchorage points (not totally sure).
I was told because it was S-Line and it had a different spare wheel compartment 5 and 7 meant the floor was also different.
When my replacement car came the first thing I looked at was the floor and it seemed to me to be identical. i think that they thought the 5 seater had a full spare but not the case in S-Line.
It happened to 3 of us at the same time and all were replaced. I later heard of two more also replaced.
I suspect that the standard number of seats in each country is set by the importers not Audi in Germany. I do not know what is their standard format.
The ordering codes in my case were 5KA (the one i questioned with armrestsand seat fore aft adjustment), 5KM(3 rear seatswith armrests (deletes third row)), 5KY (four rear seats with armrests) as 6 seater.
On the other issue of price, cheer up i paid 101200 Euros for mine here in Ireland. S-Line 3.0 TDI Mugello Blue Verano Leather, SEVEN seats, Bose, Removable Tow bracket, Mirror memory, Parking Plus, High MMI, Auto dim Mirrors with compass Bluetooth phone prep. When I complained about the price on Audiworld i was quickly put in my place by a Swedish owner who paid nearly twice that.
Check your original order form re seats. You must have ticked something.<ul><li><a href="http://forums.audiworld.com/q7/threads/652.phtml#3549">My experience in July</a></li></ul>
01-19-2007, 11:11 AM
01-19-2007, 11:44 AM
01-19-2007, 11:57 AM
Well what happened was I received the options lists, ticked what i wanted and faxed them back. On the options lists in Greece it had nothing about the car or seats itself. They simply have one options list for a 3.0TDI and one for the 4.2. They didnt even have the S-Line package on the options form. I had to ask them about it after seeing it in the brochure and they said ... Oh, that, yeah there is an exterior package and an interior package. Again, this was not what other sources were saying. I think they make it up as they go along.
Regarding the seats, because i only chose the exterior S-Line package (which incidentally, does not include any alloy wheel upgrade) i do not have the S-Line interior. This may be why i am now able to add the rear two seats as a retrofit?
Regarding the price; i heard the Greek tax status on premium veicles is going through a change, as it contradicts the EUs policy on competition. Anyone know what this change is and when we can hope to see an improvement?
01-19-2007, 02:29 PM
so you could order? How did a Greek Dealer come to have an English Brochure and how come they didnt note the difference for you. Do the Greek Dealers know there is a difference. I mean there must be a reason for them to have it in English like they need to order cars from it. It seems odd that they have it. I know I would be in there saying what is the difference in Greece for orders with seven seats because that much i pay the rest is down to the dealer. There must be some meeting point. I filled out 4 pages of specifications ticking boxes in duplicate so I had a copy of the order. My dealer confirmed the order by email also containing all specs. It seems a long way from how you did it.
I can see you havent paid for the extra seats but the retro fit is not all down to you.
Anyway, something else, do you have 4 zone aircon as the third row passengers will complain if not.
S-Line. It is strange that you got electric retracting hitch on S-Line as it is not available due to reinforced bumpers! You also do not have S-Line wheels. I tried but could not order the twin spoke alloys as they did not meet the Specs for S-Line. I was offered them as an exchange but warned they would seriously devalue my car. I declined.
You expressed a concern re secondhand value after fitting third row. It seems more likely to go up than down. I have had 7 fully grown adults several times in mine. Yes its tight but not that bad.
01-20-2007, 12:17 AM
This is something you learn about Greeks when you deal with them. Details to them are minor and unimportant. They obviously sent me an English brochure in the hope that it was neutral, i very much doubt if they took the time to look into it in detail and make sure it agreed with the Greek brochure. I accept some of the blame as I did not cross reference my investigations, but also know that a large part of the blame falls on the dealer. I could fight with them, argue my case and try to convince them to bring in two new vehicles, but after waiting 4 months already i am only too happy to hear that the vehicles are there.
I am not sure about the retracting hitch situation. Yes we have it, but it seems that the S-Line pachage we have is very limited and only includes the S-Line exterior bumpers and skirts.
Regarding the wheels, i saw the 5 spoke S-Line wheels in the brochure, but again this was never offered as an option on the order form. We were only offered the standard wheel packages and went for the 20". They seem to have a very different take on S-Line in Greece, compared to anywhere else in the world it seems.
I have not seen the vehicles in person yet (I am in London and Geneva over the next few weeks) but as soon as I get back over to Greece (estimated beginning of Feb) i will post pictures of the 'Greek speced' S-Line vehicles.
Sorry, i was actually expressing a concern as to the secondhand value of the vehicles without the last two seats. I am sure it will have an effect, but depending on when we decide to change vehicles it might not be worth spending an extra 5,000 + Euros.
01-20-2007, 03:57 AM
There is no difference in price of 5 and 7 seater here which seems a bit strange unless they just price the 7 seater. I would imagine there must be about 2000 difference anyway.
If its going to take you so long to get back over would you not have the seats installed by then anyway.
My Dealer still has 2 of the 5 Seaters that he changed for us 4 months later. i think given a choice people will always pick the 7 seater as 3rd folded down gives the exact same rear space anyway.
You say you have S-Line exterior package but it doesnt add up. Do you know if your cars have 4 and 2 bar grilles under headlamps. Maybe someone can check for you over there. I suspect you just have matched in paint on standard bumpers and skirts because of your hitch. You can also tell from the exhaust tips as TDI S-Line are not chromed. Click my account# and then pictures to see. Your pictures will be very interesting when U do get there.
By the way it only took Audi 8 weeks to replace our cars.
01-20-2007, 06:06 AM
you have to remember that this is Greece and everything takes a lot longer here. They said that it will be at least a couple of months before they have the seats in.
Although i am not out there do not think the cars are not being used. As i said my father went to collect the cars, he is using one and another of our more senior staff is using the other until my arrival.
I will ask about the exhausts and the grill under the headlamps. I will also try to get a hold of some photos sooner.