This is relevant to the engine forum, since most 12v engines are old (I prefer to call that "well broken in" ;-) ) and could need some internal cleaning.
Lately, based solely on its marketing, not on its performance, I cannot with good conscience further recommend Auto-Rx. Whether or not the product works, I do not know. I have used the product and did not notice any cleaning, but my engine was clean to begin with. Many people have been happy with this product.
However, its seems to me, the Auto-Rx folks are advertising their product in a pushy manner through what appears to me like a number of stooges and shills. Of course I could be wrong about that, and it is merely my opinion, which I do not claim to represent fact. It's just my perception.
Since I have over the past years occasionally recommended A-Rx as an engine cleaner, I believe I am somewhat responsible if anybody did in fact use the product, whether it worked or not.
<b>I now advise anybody who plans on using A-Rx to carefully read the product's disclaimer, or to ask to see the disclaimer before purchasing the product.</b>
Thank you for your attention!
01-16-2009, 08:12 AM
I used it several years ago, but I am not sure it did what it claimed.
I saw no difference.
01-16-2009, 08:13 AM
the letter with no visible or otherwise perceptible results whatsoever... none, nada, zero, zilch, bupkus. Nothing good, nothing bad... just NOTHING!
01-16-2009, 08:18 AM
01-16-2009, 08:19 AM
You might offend a forum sponsor. ;-)
That sponsor might even go out of his way and call you names. I don't see how that can be good for business.
01-16-2009, 08:37 AM
that single post. I do know you have struggled there from time-to-time and I have to admire your stick-toitiveness. Buncha soup (oil) Nazis!
01-16-2009, 08:56 AM
My struggles there are over. I can't endorse a product that is marketed the way A-Rx is now.
I dared say I visually didn't notice any cleaning and that I also did not notice any other benefit (such as better gas mileage or less oil leaks). That was interpreted as an offense, as a condemnation of the product. In the end I was called a liar over showing the clean pre-A-Rx "cleaning" picture of my engine. Supposedly it wasn't my engine at 122k miles, but a new engine. Go figure.
A forum sponsor will always "win" on BITOG. However, I can and do retract my (marginal) endorsement of the product simply based on what I consider shady marketing. Even if A-Rx is the Holy Grail of engine cleaners, at this point I will never again use it.
01-16-2009, 09:10 AM
with some of the before/after photos of cylinder heads and valve trains from people claiming they used nothing but A-Rx, following the recommended procedure and the pics showed the results. The "before" pics showed vulgarly gunked up, sludged-out and varnished-over parts... nastiest examples I've EVER seen! I mean thes things looked like they came out of a Baghdad Taxi! Then "some" if not most of the "after" pics showed heads that were so fastidiously shiney-clean that there's no way short of acid dip, high pressure cleaning as well as mechanical hand-polishing could possibly make those parts look the way they did! I mean when an "after" pic looks dramatically better than a new "crate" sand-cast OEM head from the factory there's a weasel in the woodpile somewhere. "If it looks/sounds too good to be true" there's a always a VERY good reason for that!
I'm still surprised even today I allowed myself to buy into their hype. I know better than ANY "tune-up/clean-up-in-a-can" crappola and that "an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure." But when buying used cars we're kinda stuck as it relates to "prevention" and have to resort to "cure."
01-16-2009, 09:21 AM
01-16-2009, 09:41 AM
If "they" show before and after pictures, then it's evidence. If I show a before picture, then it's a lie. I'm actually surprised they didn't suggest this was a post-A-Rx treatment photo. ;-)
Anyway, it all smacks very much of fish mongering, and I don't like the smell one bit.
01-16-2009, 11:58 AM
...the head ports and the backs of the valves surprisingly clean, very similar to the photo Mance posted here some time ago.
I was at that moment reminded of why it was recommended here on this forum that we send our old injectors to Russ Collins and do the I/M to head, gasket-matching.
One can readily visualize the before and after effects of the above two mods on the air/fuel mixture that hits the back-side of the very hot intake valve.
Before: Drippy old leaking injectors all squirting different amounts and patterns; big globs of fuel sloughing off the "head-shelf" and laying on the valves back-side; versus
After: Cleaned, calibrated, and balanced injectors all spraying exactly the same pattern <i>into the air</i> as opposed to that head-shelf.
Those two procedures alone are probably responsible for the "picture perfect" new clean view I got. No additives required.
01-16-2009, 12:35 PM
Then again, my car was already old when I found out. At this point I merely shrug my shoulders. I'd love to have the time and space to tweak the engine. I always enjoy the pictures that you guys show of what you have accomplished.
01-16-2009, 04:21 PM
Next thing you know, Frank will be using your photo to show others what a marvelous job ARX did.
BTW, I used it in my car and didn't notice any difference either. Then again, it only had 30k miles at the time, so maybe there was nothing to clean there, even if ARX was capable of cleaning.
01-16-2009, 05:03 PM
So just like I, you were neither over or underwhelmed by the product? That's reassuring. ;-)
I better don't find my picture giving testimony in someone else's name!
Your BMW looks like a panther on the prowl.
01-16-2009, 05:54 PM
Another product/service which I am probably not going to use again since his prices have skyrocketed.
The 'panther' sits in the garage for the most part... I'm trying to reduce its salt ingress.
01-16-2009, 06:48 PM
I might still get a basic Blackstone (etc) UOA to satisfy my curiosity, which admittedly isn't very high.
I'd mostly be interested in wear, but UOA is not the tool for determining that -- tearing down the engine is. No thanks! ;-)
01-16-2009, 06:49 PM
It looks like someone dumped Bosco over the poor thing! :D
This was a recommendation I received from TD. After following the treatment, as recommended by A-Rx, I did notice that the oil stayed cleaner longer. It was not so quick to turn black.
I have yet to send in another oil sample for analysis. If it did work, my chromium level should drop - according to TD.
01-18-2009, 11:57 PM
Chromium is usually from piston rings. If the chromium numbers drops, this may indicate that the ring and groove area may indeed be cleaner now. Then the rings seal now better. If so, good for you!
A good indication to judge if an engine is in good working condition are the insolubles (carbon/soot). If, after changing to another oil, or after cleaning the engine internally, the insolubles number drops, the the engine appears to be cleaner. Insolubles should be under 06% in gasser. I'm not sure about insolubles in a diesel. Oils that are designed for diesel engines, can hold more soot in suspension than oils that were designed for gas engines can. Oils for diesel engines contain also more detergents than do oils for gassers.
Used oil analysis is a poor indicator of how any engine wears. You would really have to establish a baseline by doing UOA after UOA over a long period. Even then, you can really see only wear trends. To determine actual wear, you really have to tear the engine down and start measuring, which is of course unpractical and reserved for race car engines.
01-19-2009, 03:28 AM
I do want to know if there is any improvement from the cleaning treatment. This is the first oil change after the cleaning treatment. I am running the M1 5W-40 Turbo Diesel.
Have you ever tried any RLI products?
01-19-2009, 04:00 AM
I don't find their mostly testimonial-based and rather pushy marketing technique attractive. In fact, it torques me off.
M1 5W-40 Turbo Diesel should work very well in your Benz. A less expensive oil like Shell Rotella-T 5W-40 would also work well.
01-19-2009, 09:16 AM
...yours truly in this regard, did the head intake ports gasket-match; outside. So there you go, shows what thinking outside the 6 surfaces of a typical garage can do.