View Full Version : Ok, I started the IM R&R this morning after locating some decent gasket material I had stored...


VAP
09-07-2008, 02:03 PM
<center><img src="http://pictureposter.audiworld.com/711/imgasketlapping1.jpg"></center><p>
not enough to make a gasket between the IM upper/lower halves but plenty to make IM-to-head gaskets and a new throttle body gasket. I actually have tons of the OEM gaskets around but after last time I'm taking no chances on ANYTHING leaking this time and being totally/completely 100% leak-free!

The pic above show everything ready to start testing after a serious cleaning. I've laid out a 18" x 22" lapping surface using 320 grit sandpaper and glued it to the counter with 3M #77 repositionable adhesive. I ran some 2" wide 3M masking tape on about 1/8" of the sandpaper which I'll tape newspapers to so if I sand "outside the lines" I won't be rubbing the grit around on my counters and start sanding them or risk knocking the gloss off.

All manifold sealing surfaces have been "blacked" with a giant permanent magic marker. By doing that then lapping them lightly, and ONLY under their own weight I'll be able to tell very quickly how flat their gasket mating surfaces are. Then all I have to do is continue lapping them, again under their own weight in left-right-up-down and circular motions with no downward pressure applied by me they'll soon become flat unless they're severely outta wack which a straight-edge has confirmed that's not the case. I also fly-cut, surfaced and hand-lapped some heavy aluminum lapping blocks you can see in lower right. Their job will be to lap areas on IM that cannot be lapped on a flat surface like ISV flange, EGR flange, intake runner outlets and cylinder heads. I simply attach sandpaper to their machined-flat surface with 3M adhesive and use these an ALL flanged gasket sealing surfaces that cannot be done on the horizontal lapping surface.

The gasket material I'm using is pressed fiber and nitrile. It has a constant working temperature rating of 400 degrees and can accept intermittant spikes up to 700 degrees. It's 60% thicker than the stock IM-to-head OEM gaskets and has no aluminum foil within it's composite. In pic you can see the gasket shapes drawn on the new material with the "Sharpie" ultra-fine tipped permanent marking pen. I'll be cutting them by hand with the X-acto knife and on the 1/2" thick piece of temptered glass with beveled edges I keep around just for gasket-cutting. The glass plate also occasionally see's double duty as a small lapping plate for very precision work on smaller parts as it's an incredibly "known-flat" and HARD surface. The new throttle body gasket will be over 3 times thicker than the OEM gasket.

I'll fix myself some lunch now and start lapping this evening. I'll describe the process and post pics of that project and my findings related to warpage as I move thru this process. As you can tell I'm DEAD-SERIOUS about zero intake leaks this time out!! I fully expect this to drag out over today and ALL of tomorrow just doing sealingt surface prep work. Probably be Tuesday before IM gets re-installed or before I find out if this has all been wasted time or if my IM leakage has been cured. But I'm doing EVERYTHING humanly possible with no short-cuts and NOTHING half-assed!

The Devil
09-07-2008, 07:20 PM
I'm going to cut off the abs sensor housing from the hub carrier and if I can lightnen it anywhere else I was thinking about it. Would it be possible to lighten much like the drilled upper rear control arms u did inbetween the upper and lower mounting holes to the strut housing?

U know what i'm talking about correct?


while i'm at it:

what's your opinion on nord-locks btw? Happy with the factory audi bolts in the suspension setup? I'm considering using Nylon lock nuts, the nord-locks and the factory bolts as long as I have enough threads to work with on the setup. Going to order a bunch of different size nords tomorrow.

thanks
josh

VAP
09-08-2008, 04:01 AM
I'm sure there are ways... maybe many ways but to date I've limited my weight-loss efforts to the sub-assemblies that the hubs/carriers bolt to.

Only issue I've personally seen with "Nords" is that thay eat and gaul into the fasteners and the surface that those fasteners are bolted to. I've seen race cars with almost 1/4" deep bores dug into them where the Nords have eaten away and dug into material via repeated high-torque frequent R&amp;R's of the fasteners. I personally prefer "uni-torque" style nuts to most any other option. Same nuts I provide with all Pro-Mounts for the upper strut nut.

The Devil
09-08-2008, 04:41 AM
<center><img src="http://pictureposter.audiworld.com/19850/v8project_014.jpg"></center><p>I had a funny feeling u'd like the "uni-torque" nuts. I've been reading Carroll Smith's nuts, bolts, and fasteners and plumbing. I can see why when it comes to something like heat they would be more popular than the nylon lock nuts.

I think i'm going to use the "nords" in places like on the drive axles under the allen head bolts. Ironically after reading that book I know I should be calling them socket-head cap screw. Nords are not even in the book but I came across them when I was looking at finishing the design of my brake lines.

Hopefully i'm picking up a few 55 gallon drums today for the cabinet and an external/internal wood burning stove setup for the garage.

Spent all night trying to figure out the best method to do it cheap, safe and without a internal flue. I think i got it now.

VAP
09-08-2008, 05:02 AM
nylon has little-to-no elasticity/memory and once you run a bolt thru a Nylok nut then remove it it's "locking feature" has been severely compromised. The uni-torque unless heated to 700 degrees or higher while "on" the bolt retains it's spring tension and can be R&amp;R'd hundreds of times. They cost slightly more but are cheap insurance.

The Devil
09-08-2008, 05:10 AM
it's one time use?

I was going to use both, a lock nut and the nord-locks in a few areas as somewhat of a reassurance that it's not coming apart?

VAP
09-08-2008, 05:30 AM
also if you drill a 6.5mm hole in a 1" thick nylon block then tap it with an 8x1.5 (the correct drill/tap size) thread pitch bolt (not a tap) you have to twist the bolt in with a ratchet/socket the first time to "form" the threads (not "cut" threads as a tap would do)... just like the bolt does when threading into a nylok ring at the top of a nut. Once you remove that bolt you can turn it in by hand the next time. And the locking ring in a nylok is a LOT thinner than a 1" thick "block" of nylon!

Another test is strike a piece of nylon with a hammer and see if the dent the hammer makes in it's surface ever goes away. Hint: it won't.

I machine a LOT of Nylon, Nylatron (graphite impregnated nylon), Delrin, Acetron GP. If nylon had any elastomeric memory at all for "bouncing back" it would be used in a LOT of suspension bushings. It doesn't! Another problem with nylon is it fractures easily when cold... becomes very brittle and breaks/shatters on impact. There's alos not a lot of Nylon durometer hardnesses availble. Most hover in the 90 Shore D range (think bowling ball).

While nylon can "look" fine doesn't mean it will "measure" fine when used as a fastener locking feature. And with thread "fitments" you just can't tell by "looking" how well a bolt/nut is fitting. You "have" to measure and there are formulas for thread engaging fitments like G, H, or I or GG, HH, II etc. There is nothing for nylon-to-thread fitment.

To me Nyloks are indeed "single use only" or consecutive uses with Loctite only.

The Devil
09-08-2008, 05:33 AM
As far as nylocks were concerned I was thinking i'd ex them out. Sounds like I will be now.

Thanks
josh

your time is appreciated.

VAP
09-08-2008, 05:43 AM
for some CNC'd hi-tech "assemble-and-forget-about-it" fixtures like in laboratory and medical settings. But not very good for "mission-critical" car componentry subject to extreme vibration, high tensional fastener loading and stress.

The Devil
09-09-2008, 10:32 PM
from the whole hub. Next time I do it, i'm doing it in the sand blasting cabinet that i'm building and just keep the dremel in side of it. i've got so many small pieces of metal imbedded in the bottom of my feet because i wore sandals that i swear i'll never do it again without the cabinet. I haven't touched the driver side housing. I'll finish the passenger side and then weight the difference when i'm done with the passenger unit. I haven't removed any material via the drill press. It doesn't look like it should happen. if anything it looks nice.. kinda like a hot rod part. It doesn't matter though because they're going to get sand blasted and painted with silver Por 15.

P.S. "A must for rust" is good stuff.