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Ok, since Sammy brought up this topic, can anyone PLEASE tell me more about it.<p>My friend is SERIOUSLY considering getting an A4 1.8T or 2.8. I have driven the car and thought it is definitely a nice car. However, that was only a test drive at my local dealer. Test drives won't tell you the whole story. So, can anyone tell me what are some of the Pros and Cons of A4s? Thanks.<p>~Prelude SH

I was about to buy an A4 but not anymore. I have heard about to many problems they go through: these problems start at about 1000 ,iles and go one. Audi dealers will keep their cars in there for days. i am just not going to get an Audi till i am guarnteed that the car will not bring forth many maintainace problems.<p>its his choice. let him look at the new passats. Vw is a very good car and good track record<p>sammy

I have a 1990 jetta and my wife drives a 1997 jetta. tell you what we have never been to shop unless for tune ups and oil changes:) life goes on with great cars.<p>sammy

for starters, we had a VW Rabbit that was NOTHING but problems. Then came a VW Vanagon. Our Vanagon has had cracked heads 3 times already, the first time at 35,000 miles. This problem is discussed frequently on www.vanagon.com. The transmission has gone twice. The fuel pump has gone three times. The constant velocity joints have been creaky since 30,000 miles. The body is rusting all over. The fuel line broke and left us stranded in the middle of nowhere in Utah. The accelerator line broke and stranded us again. There have been more problems than I can remember. From what I've heard from friends with VW's, the quality is still poor. I remember reading about DonP's LARGE number of problems with his GTI too. I figure Audi can't be much worse. My two cars before my A4 were a Mercedes 190E 2.3 and a BMW 325es. So far I am much more happy with my A4 than either of those cars. <p>Mike

We still have own it. Mercedes 240D. Near 200,000 miles with NO problems. Still on the original clutch too. The car has only been in for services. That's reliability. My friend drove his 300TD for 475,000 problem free miles until he needed a new engine. His tranny didn't go until over 500,000 miles.<p>Mike

Pro's: It's a nicely balanced car; good looks, comfortable interior, decent if not terribly exciting performance, and most importantly, all wheel drive.<p>Probably the biggest Con is that it's not going to be as reliable as its Japanese competitors.<br>

Do people with no problems with an A4 post as much as people with problems? If there were a Jetta forum like this one would nobody be posting problems? The only objective evidence that exists (such as Consumer Reports reliability ratings), put Audi ahead of VW. Right now, Audi ends up with about a "B" grade for reliability when judged against all makes of cars that are out there. That's worse than Toyota and Honda (the best makes for reliability), but better or equal to almost everything else. VW gets approximately a "D", and I'm being generous (it could be interpreted as "F"). Personally, this concerns me because Audi and VW are obviously related and use lots of the same parts. But something is definitely different. (Assembly in Mexico vs. Germany has been a problem for VW, I think).<p>Anybody with an A4 that has a problem is naturally going to post it on this forum to see if anyone else has had the problem, to try to find an answer, to see if it really is a problem, etc. Not too many people come here to post that they didn't have any problems this week!<p>You can't read through a bunch of postings like those on this forum and conclude anything about what percentage of owners are having problems. You can probably figure out what some of the major trouble spots are, however, and that is valuable. My personal list of problems with my A4, over 11,000 miles:<p>- Windshield replaced due to distortion problem. Replacement not too good either, but much better. All current Audi AND VW windshields that I have checked are showing the same problem, though (that includes Jettas!).<p>- Cruise control "hyperactive". Dealer agreed. Got much better as more miles were put on the car, no longer significant.<p>- Spare tire holddown knob/bolt was stripped, missing fuse puller. Both replaced under warranty.<p>That's it. No breakdowns, unplanned dealer visits, etc. Just a note on Sammy's and some others' posts: PLEASE put (nt) for no text after your messages when the subject line is the complete message. That way people don't have to open the message to find nothing there. Thanks.

From my past research, the Jetta had poor reliability which some attribute to being made in VW's Mexican plants. (I know lots of good stuff is made in Mexico, this is a comment VW's Mexican plants, not the nation as a whole.) The Passat had much better reliability and was (is?) made in Germany. Get the facts on reliability. "Reputation" is just a biased opinion.<p>Steve (98 2.8QMS)

My first 95 Jetta VR6 was a beaut - and trouble free for 3 years until I was T-boned and the car was totaled. My second 96 Jetta VR6 was a pain in the butt, nothing but problems.<p>So what do you make of this - a 50% reliability?<br>I'm sure it's better than that, but I'm one dissapointed VW owner. One of the very important reasons I decided to get an A4 was the warranty - much much better than VW's. You'd be surprised, but I think Audi may have a lower cost of ownership than VW, at least in the first 3-4 years.<p>Good luck to you, whatever your choice!<br>Andrei D

So while your driving your "adverage" Passat, I'll pass you in my "upscale" A4. Oh, and the BMW and MB owners won't even look twice at you.

If you mean you see posts here about problems, that's what this board is for! to share experiences... you aren't going to (I hope) just see a litany of posts engaging in mutual masturbation about what nice cars we have (tho' we get our share of those, too :-) ) <p>Remember, a technician only sees broken cars; if you go to a repair shop, you'll see broken cars. If you go to a site like this where people share information about issues, then you'll hear about broken cars. You have to take the numbers in context.... go to ANY automotive board like this and you'll see enough anecdotal evidence to keep you from buying anything. Your choice, or your friend's of course. But judge the information in context or you're not making an informed decision.

see my post below. You have 2 good Jettas. That's good. Therefore, all Jettas are good? No. You hear about some problems with A4s here. Therefore A4s are unreliable? No.<p>It's all anecdotal evidence, not scientific sampling. Take it for what it's worth...

That's an interesting point: my '90 Acura Integra was one of the most reliable cars I've ever owned. No major repairs in 4+ years (then I got bored with it & sold it). My '94 Mercedes-Benz C280 was one of the most unreliable cars I've owned in terms of unscheduled repairs (only one of which affected driveability) --- 26 in 5 yrs.<p>Guess which one cost more to maintain, insure, etc.? The reliable Integra. It had such high maintenance costs because of Honda's overly thorough maint. schedule (they practically rebuild the whole car by the time it's gone 90,000 miles) that the Mercedes-Benz had a LOWER cost per mile cost of ownership. My take is that the Honda/Toyota/Acuras are reliable, but are not necessarily "economical"; and I would take a 100,000-mile Audi or MB over a 100k Honda/Toyota any day, IMO.

If you think that the people that post here reflect a statistically independent sample of Audi owners, you're an idiot (you probably have no idea what a "statistically independent sample" is or why that's important). Since I own an Audi, I'd prefer you own any other car but an Audi or VW. I want Audi and VW owners (since Audi is part of VW) to have a reputation for being intelligent. You're clearly not..

In my list of 3 "problem" areas in the post above, I forgot what should have been a 4th one:<p>- Nut on back of driver side airbag loosened and fell off inside horn pad assembly, making lots of noise. Fixed myself 15 minutes after it happened. This is the only thing that I can remember that has happened with the car that wasn't that way when it left the factory. The other problems were parts quality or assembly quality related.

Also you can't compare the [much] cheaper-feeling interior of the Jetta with the A4; I'm ordering one as a second car to replace a 1993 Honda Civic EX, but it's DEFINITELY not even close to the quality of the Passat/A4/A6/etc. (I consider it of European rental-car quality - and that's the GLS I drove).<p>The VR6 is also a "crap-shoot" motor - some good and many bad. I had an "okay" one (only my coolant tank blew up), and made it perfect by installing a new throttle body, APS chip, APS FilterCharger, 8mm spark plug wires, etc., keeping it regularly serviced and using synthetic.<p>This is, though, the A4 forum.<p>-josh<br>98.5 2.8qms<br>99.? Jetta GLX VR6 (on order.......)