<center><img src="http://pictureposter.audiworld.com/54525/thirdfourthgraph1.jpg"></center><p>
FYI,

Car is a '97 A4 with a 2.0L conversion, T3/T4E turbo, 3" exhaust, hi flow cat, FMIC, apexi afc, wideband monitor, etc. The data graph below was taken this AM, a 3-4 gear pull(S4 6 speed drivetrain). Ambient temp read 38F, engine temps normal. New OEM spark plugs (triple prong- F7-LTCR) installed 1 day ago.

the base fuel pressure is about 52 psi, 70 psi@full boost, running 410cc injectors.

Boost is 1.7 bar, approximately 24-25 psi.

Egt's seemed to table out(briefly!) at about 920 celcius/1688F! Temp sensor is centered just prior to the turbo, which gives me higher than actual readings.

Afr under WOT was in the 10's between roughly 3000-4000 rpms, but went to the low 12's from 4000 on up.

Timing went into the low 30's, seemed to be doing what it's supposed to. Does it look like it backed off in 4th gear there?

MAF reading looks low, due to the manipulation from the apexi afc. It's max recorded reading was in the 130's, but the injectors still max out. Wish I could get a better chip......

Felt awesome! Hanging onto the steering wheel with a death grip! Butt-dyno reports it's all good!

What kind of numbers are you pulling? Notice any great change since you're at near freezing temps? Congrats.

gotta get the egt's down some, &amp; fuel/ignition curves are the problem IMO.

<center><img src="http://home.comcast.net/~audi2ptzero/AF-1-4th.jpg"></center><p>91 octane with the ecu pulling back timing with about 18-20psi and still running a little rich dipping into the high 10's.

or 440cc @ 3bar of fuel pressure

grass hopper. =P

I've got gas pumps for injectors!

Guess I'll put the quadra-jet carburetor back on....

Actually, IIRC,the guy that sold them to me told me they were 410cc.....*cough*

IME when running over 4 bar statoc the orange respond better. little diff in output but the orange have higher limit and better pattern.
My $.02
Rod

to fire hoses like mine =P

your 450cc at 3 bar vs my 800cc at 3 bar

You can read up on if you want at www.tuneyourengine.com

<center><img src="http://www.fiveomotorsport.com/PartsJPEGs/Injectors/InjectD5B.jpg"></center><p>

This isnt guessing this is fact (on the 110 a hole). The oragne is also used on a few of the Porsche turbo's. You guys know I am sure that these have to be matched to SW and that diff injectors have higher and lower tap out points.

Sounds great. Yeah, it sounds like the fuel/ignition. Where did you say the timing was again? 30s? I'm not an Audi motor pro, but that seems pretty far out.

at 1045 celcius. I'm not disagreeing with anyone, I want my egt's down! But if that's a parameter on an OEM engine, I think as long as I'm under that I'll be ok, within reason.

The whole thing with the egt too, is my sensor isn't in a good spot. It should be in a path that's dedicated to an individual cylinder (#1 runner for example) and it's not. It's located dead center in front of the turbo inlet. I described it to someone today, as,......

think of a cigarette lighter. One alone would be hot, but put 4 together, it wouldn't be 4X hotter, but it would definitely hit a higher temp....

Unfortunately, I don't know how much higher it is. On the other hand, it's a safety net, like setting your watch 10 minutes fast. ;-)

If your running 25 psi with a base fuel pressure of 52psi, you should be seeing 77psi at peak boost not 70. Should help the AFRs and Egts with a little more pressure up top.

I think I found my next "mod".....yes? Probably about time I switched the filter too.<ul><li><a href="http://www.atpturbo.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&amp;Product_Code=ATP-VVW-020&amp;Category_Code=VVWFE">ATP 255 lph fuel pump</a></li></ul>

you can find the fuel pump you need from a Mustang performance shop. It is a Walbro 255 High output. Just make sure when you wire it up that you reverse the wires on the top of the pump.

13 degs at 5500 rpms.

at wot for pump gas. His car is actually running about where it should for AF, which is low 12's high 11's. Still needs to log it to see if the ecu is pulling out any timing. Adv timing will be much higher in the lower rpms since there is no load on the motor and the turbo has not yet started to move alot of air.

DIY :)<ul><li><a href="http://forums.audiworld.com/performance/msgs/44541.phtml">http://forums.audiworld.com/performance/msgs/44541.phtml</a></li></ul>

but I'm too lazy to graph it. You guys can cut and paste into a *.CSV file and display it in excel if you want

First was a 2nd-3rd run, the 2nd was a 3rd gear pull, the AFR came from my WB O2 logs, I have no idea why it went lean in the first run around 5000 RPM.

Running about 20psi, 580cc injectors.

TIME,RPM,Load,Injection,MAF,Throttle,Timing,AFR
15.52,2000,2.5,2.43,16.25,28.6,-35.3,13.5
16.07,2120,5.2,6.98,35.42,77.3,-17.3,11.67
16.62,2400,5.6,5.95,42.92,78.1,-15.8,12.7
17.16,2600,6.25,6.59,51.94,78.6,-14.3,12.5
17.71,2920,7.1,7.62,66.25,78.6,-15,12.45
18.26,3280,8.2,9.09,86.11,79,-18,11.6
18.84,3720,9.5,11.39,112.64,79,-19.5,11.75
19.37,4240,10.85,12.74,146.87,79,-19.5,12.5
19.91,4920,10.85,13.95,170.14,79,-18,15
20.46,5560,10.85,14.59,191.67,79,-15,15.2
21.02,6240,10.85,16.32,215.21,79,-16.5,12.7
21.56,6840,10.85,16.32,235.62,79.4,-18,11.5
22.11,7360,10.85,16.32,253.54,79,-18,10.8
22.65,7760,10.85,16.32,267.84,62.5,-18.8,10.9
23.21,6920,0.9,0,2.08,81.6,-24,12
23.76,5480,11.2,16,198.4,82,-12,10.85
24.31,5680,12.7,16.32,229.93,82,-12,10.8
24.85,5920,12.65,16.32,240.28,81.2,-15,10.36
25.41,6200,12.55,16.32,245.48,81.2,-12.8,10.2
25.97,6440,10.85,16.32,221.39,81.2,-17.3,10.8
26.51,6640,10.85,16.32,228.96,81.2,-14.3,10.7
27.08,6880,11.6,16.32,254.72,81.2,-16.5,10.8
27.62,7080,11.2,16.32,252.84,80.7,-15.8,10.8
28.15,7200,10.85,16.32,248.12,15.2,-37.5,10.8

67.75,3200,2.25,2.24,22.71,24.7,-39.8,13.3
68.3,3200,2.45,2.37,25.34,26.9,-38.3,13.2
68.87,3320,4.4,5.44,46.04,51.2,-23.3,12.1
69.41,3520,6.4,7.55,71.32,78.1,-21.8,11.8
69.95,3840,8.6,11.2,105.14,78.6,-20.3,12.3
70.5,4320,12.55,15.17,171.87,78.6,-17.3,11.2
71.06,4960,12.75,16.19,200.9,78.6,-15.8,13.3
71.6,5560,12.75,16.32,225.83,78.6,-12.8,12.8
72.15,6200,12.75,16.32,250.76,78.6,-16.5,10.9
72.71,6760,12.75,16.32,273.06,78.6,-18,10.9
73.25,7280,10.85,16.32,250.21,77.7,-19.5,11
73.8,7640,10.7,16.32,261.87,15.2,-16.5,10.8

exhaust manifold failure, and there have hardly been any turbo failures, at least among those who have taken proper care. So the point is, why are you raising this alarm? I don't care what you were told about metal getting soft. "Getting soft" isn't the problem, it's the stress caused by heat cycling that ususlaly leads to cracks.

ever consider the fact that different metals have vastly different thermal properties? And aluminum does not "melt" at that temperature. Melt is a pretty imprecise term that has nothing to do with the thermal stresses that causes cracking in manifolds due to heat cycling. You cannot get a manifold hot enough to actually soften and deform under any conditions that I can think of.

a lot cheaper, and a much easier install

but considering the head is water-cooled, and the pistons have oil-squirters on them, I'm not too worried.

As long as it's not detonating.

And in case you didnt know, the problem isnt melting the manifold it is the piston and turbine impeller. Do you do your own work on engines or have U ever done a hi perf turbo car b4? You may want to be concerned with these temps. If you dont get it then blow an engine, no skin off my back. Some of you guys would do well to work on these cars some if you want to get into performance, and read something other than the **** (for most part) posted on this site. Of course if you just run 1 stoplight at a time it probably isnt an issue to you. If you do 3 bar boost or track days you should pay attn..
Rod

crank the boost up, timing has to come down.

Keep in mind these are mass-produced chips, and they must work with the lowest common denominator.

All cars are not equal, so obviously, a custom chip would make more power.

But in Mat's case, it is an inferior chip, ATP chips suck.

Yes a lower CR of 8.5:1 can run more timing and I can run even more with just 8:1. But as john just pointed out, when you start pushing high boost and the IAT's increase with that increase in boost you need to lower the adv timing or increase the octane.

With no issues, temps in mid 860's c, and no dial back in timing. Depends on how well you can control fuel, which is the big problem home tuners have... right?
Rod

I run 91 octane at 17psi of boost and am able to hold 30 degs while running low 11:1 and high 10:1.

Maybe around 15-20 degs max.

temps or higher, and that the info you gave on "melting aluminum" was incorrect. And yes, I have built a Gen. 2 Eclipse GSX myself, and do all the work on my A4. What about you? For all your talk it sounds like while you may have a built car, you haven't turned a wronch on it.