If anyone can offer some advice hear, I'd really appreciate it.

I just spoke to my dealer, my 225 coupe has been produced and assigned a VIN, and is awaiting transport. He verified that this car does NOT have ESP. Should be here in 1-2 months. By the way, I am taking delivery in SF, California.

After speaking to Audi Customer Service, I was informed this car will have the suspension mods and spoiler, but no ESP. Only 225's that are assigned a build date AFTER May are guaranteed to have ESP already installed. (she was not able to tell me what build dates in May would actually have ESP). Also she told me that builds take 3 to 6 months, which seems rather long to me. (mine went from D status pre-production to produced in 2 weeks, so maybe she meant total order time)
The only other indication I got is that they are trying to see if it is possible to offer ESP retrofitting at the DEALERSHIPS sometime during or after this summer.

So...this leaves me with this question...
Should I take delivery on this non-ESP 225 ( I am guessing early May if it is held up in port) then pray I can get it retrofitted with ESP, but in the mean time enjoy the car?
Or should I try to get a different build w/ESP (June?) and wait till late summer for delivery?

Help!

I'm in the same situation,my 225QR being built now, my dealer says no ESP until June-build cars. I'm pretty sure I'm going to take delivery. From what I know about ESP( and I admit I'm no expert) I just can't see it to be that big of a deal for the way I'm going to be driving. Dealer also said the same re spoiler will be included.

I called Audi today to ask about my roadster
in transit (they know nothing, ask the dealer
they say)

They "confirmed" no 2001 car would arrive in the
usa with any mods, but you could choose spoiler
and suspension mods and maybe later ESP.

Again specified build days in mid may (after may?)
would get these new features.

Yet more confusion for me..

I ordered this car over 3 years ago and after doing a lot of research on ESP I have decided that it is worth waiting an extra 2-3 months for the right car.

From what I understand this feature is very helpful in tight situations and once you have mastered the car's handling you can turn it off. Porsche, Audi and Mercedes use it for a reason...

I hope this helps. I would suggest going into the archives and doing a little research.

Maybe I should call Audi again, ask the same question and see what answer I get this time. Is it possible that the logistics as far as the roadster is concerned is different than for the coupe???

If I could be convinced that I could get the ESP retrofit from the dealership in a reasonable amount of time in the summer, I would definitely take the earlier allocation.

nt

I did say I was waiting on a roadster... but
that seems odd doesn't it, that 225 coupes and
roadsters would be coming in completely different
in regards to spoilers and suspension mods?

And it wasn't clear why folks in the UK seem
to be seeing cars all equipped (or I misread
other posts)

I'm in the same situation and have heard the same story on mods and dates. When the dealer calls me to say the car is ready for pick up I'm going to ask the same question that I asked this week. Can ESP be retrofitted? If the answer is yes, as it was this week, I will take the car. The trouble is that there seems to be so much misinformation from the same sources at Audi. First, mods will be on early cars no ESP. Now, no mods and I get to choose which ones I want ,and ESP can be retrofitted. Audi is trying to figure out where and when. Like you I really hate to wait to summer. How about you tell dealer you will take the car if retrofit is available and let him order a car now in case not available at delivery time, lord knows both will sell.

I drove a stock unmodded 180qt and except for enough
juice ;) I thought it handled real well.. Would be nice to
compare the current cars with ones modified before having
to make a decision...

My build is in March and I have told my dealer I want factory installed ESP. If that means waiting till the summer so be it. If factory installed ESP car is not available till the fall I plan to wait till next spring in that I have no plans to drive the tt in the winter; my A4 is my daily car.

As to dealer retrofitting, I think not. See http://www.vwvortex.com/news/02_00/02_11_00/index.html for a very good desciption of ESP. This is a very comprehensive system and given the level of expertise of dealer mechanics (no disrespect intented but their main focus is oil changes, tuneups and repairs) I doubt if such work would even be possible at a dealer. Audi's original take was that ESP could not be retrofitted and in Europe they are setting up special facilities.

Eventually ESP will be standard equipment on all cars. It only works when you are in trouble and given that the vast majority of us are not expert rally drivers (again no disrespect to the ex-rally driver who died in a tt crash) I would think this is something one should wait for.

The question everyone in our situation has to answer is how impatient are we. Must you have the tt as soon as possible regardless of options - then go for it. If you want the tt with the latest of safety equipment, then wait.<ul><li><a href="http://www.vwvortex.com/news/02_00/02_11_00/index.html">http://www.vwvortex.com/news/02_00/02_11_00/index.html</a</li></ul>

I cannot understand for the life of me why on earth Audi are supplying cars to Europe with ESP and all the mods from the factory but are giving the USA and Canada the run-around. There are two possibilities I can think of and neither of them are particularly positive unfortunately.

1. They have a glut of pre-modification parts that they are using for these cars.

or

2. ESP is still not in series production and they have a limited capacity for modifying the cars at the factory. As a result modified cars are limited to Europe until the production line is updated.

There was a third option I considered but it makes me shudder to think it, and that is pre-modification European cars are being converted to US or Canadian spec and shipped over.

There may be other reasons but whichever way you look at it if you want ESP and have been allocated a non ESP car, it is a bit of a bum deal.

The only way to stop this hypothesising is to get a concrete answer out of Audi and until they can provide such an answer the results can only be negative for them.

Sorry for the rant but you have my sympathy.

Kind regards,
Paul Fletcher.

Thanks for a very informative post. I'm in the same situation and trying to make up my mind. If we were talking about a rear engined MB or BMW, or a tail happy 996, I could easily see the need for ESP. However, I do wonder how necessary this feature is in a well balanced, low to the ground, AWD vehicle. I put 50K on an A4Q and never really felt in jeopardy. Is there anyone (our European correspondents?) who has driven both? Is the difference that significant?

I have driven a Corvette with it. It does NOTHING other than slow the car down when driven at the limit!

How long have all of you been driving cars without ESP? now all of a sudden you think you need it? I would much rather have the car NOW then wait until AFTER the summe, especially if I were getting a Roadster!

I feel the same way about the mods and most especially about the spoiler!

TTFORB, you even stated that you most likely won't even need it because you don't plan on driving the car at its limit!

Get the car now and enjoy it. But whatever you do decide, DON'T allow Audi to retro-fit ESP to your car! It will take a total teardown and rebuild to install ESP post production, your car will never be put back together the same way as fresh out of the factory!

Just my $.02

Larry
180TTQ Garrett, H&R, Borla(??/??), V!, Custom Stereo

Life's too short to wait longer than neccessary for a TT. ESP is of great value if you some times lose control, crashing into curbs or other cars. If you've had your license for years without actually causing damage, ESP is mostly important as an asset at the point of selling to next owner.

Marius,
225 owner since last summer

Personally, I don't have the choice of waiting for ESP, since I've had my TT coupe since mid-October (and have enjoyed every minute of ownership). And I'm not certain what I would do if I had the choice of waiting for a car with ESP or accepting one without it. I do know that I would not, nor will I have it retrofitted with ESP, since I don't want someone dissecting my car and putting it back together again.

That said, I agree with FLVA when he says the TT sticks to the road at all sane speeeds (and some not so sane ones). And I've driven for the past 31 years without the assistance of ESP (in some very tail-happy cars). So for me, it all boils down to how comfortable I am with my own driving skills, and the kinds of crazy situations I can reasonably expect to get into behind the wheel. Like John P says, no one plans on getting into an accident, but you can plan on not getting into one. And it's impossible to assure the future. An old man I know once said to me, "Son, if your name's on the bullet..."

Entire subject field when writing? I see it right on top of what I am writing now. I don't get it...please explain. BTW, Johannes is the forum programming guru...he custom did this work.

Steve S.
00 S4

Besides, I'm often having trouble editing what I just wrote in the subject window, as it often gets corrupted when I'm moving the cursor by mouse or arrow keys.

I've really been struggling with this one, besides I've been driving Quattro's since 89, 4 cars, never had a problem keeping themon the road. Lots of miles in wicked bad weather. Timing also is an issue, my A4 sold this week will be picked up next weekend by new owner. So, any ideas on how to get to work for the next number of weeks or months or who knows how long.

After talking wth my expert Audi friend, I've determined that I would probably drive with the ESP off anyway, and it appears to even be an annoyance in some cases. I doubt my driving habits
would necessitate its use.

Here's the kicker. I was partying last night in North Beach in San Francisco last night for St. Patrick's day, and I happen to see 2 Ferrari F55's (?) within 20 minutes. About a half hour later, and brand spankin' new Silver TT. I easily forgot about the Ferarris.

I want my TT225 now (w/o ESP), not later.
And screw resale value, right!

It kinda sounds like you have a resolution problem with how the site is designed. I do hot have such a problem...in the message window...when doing a response...it works fine...and wraps text as it should...and I can see everything I type.

Email me and we can take this offline...maybe get Johannes involved...he wrote the forum code.

Steve S.
00 S4