We've a 2001 A6 Avant and we're getting ready to buy some kayaks that we plan to haul on the roof of our car (using Thule cross bars and kayak carriers). The rack sales people and folks at REI recommend also tying the kayaks down both front and rear to keep them from sailing in the wind, but I can't find any place in the front of the car to attach a tie-down strap. Any suggestions or guidance to something I didn't see under the car? Thanks.

I quit using safety lines (the bow and stern lines tied to the bumper) after six months or so.

I have an 18.5' Eskimo.

The safety lines aren't there to hold the kayak in the saddles, they are to keep the kayak from being hurled if a line breaks and to give left to right stability if the boat isn't tied down tight enough. For example, a side wind hits you and the boat jumps/slides out of the saddles and moves from left to right or vice versa.

If you think about things for a while, the bowline is pretty worthless. The stern line could help if you had a frontal crash.

I just had two good lines that I inspected and replaced regularly and tied the boat in really tight. When I had three boats in a triangle I did use the bow and stern lines since one boat couldn't be tightly secured in saddles.

The plastic boats weren't as strong as the fiberglass boats and they could be "creased" by a rope when tightly secured. I never saw many plastic boats.

I never lost a boat and kayaked year round but YOU HAVE TO KNOW WHAT YOU ARE DOING.

Now if you aren't a real man but some yuppie dink that embraces diversity, always votes Democrat, works for the government and feels red meat makes you too aggressive you should use the safety lines.

Thanks for the info Scott. I guess I should have mentioned that we have thule racks with the hull-a-port carrier to carry plastic boats that are not so long as yours. I was told the reason for the front lines is to keep the hull from acting like a sail and lifting off the front of the rack.

Glad to see the only trolling in Seattle isn't happening on Elliott Bay or beneath the Aurora Bridge.

Where are you going to carry all your wet salty gear? Your beer? In your car? With the boat riding flat you can just keep gear behind the cockpit seat and in your "container" that's safety tied in the front of the cockpit.

Stuff will want to bounce out of the boat if it is riding sideways.

<img src="http://www.seakayakermag.com/apr98/pics/harpoon.jpg">

We're in Spokane so we'll be on fresh water unless we head to my folks in Seattle or my sister's beach near Home. We'll mostly be on Eastern Washington/North Idaho lakes and flat rivers. We don't have sea kayaks, but recreational-touring for basically flat rivers and lakes. If we want to go with the hydro glides, we have to get a new, wider bar system because we have two kayaks (tandem=divorce), one with a cockpit big enough to carry our three-year old as well (making us "diok"s :-)).

I'm told the plastic may crease or warp if we leave it in the sun on a hot day or strapped in for too long a period of time. We'll be carrying all the mess in the back as much as possible, which probably means we need a rubber mat for the back (just one more expense).

My agency will be looking into your affairs, and we'll also let the IRS &amp; DEA know too, of course...

Thanks for sharing.

;-0