Yesterday, had brought my 1997 A4 1.8TQM in for servicing and the loaner was a new 99.5 A4 2.8Q with the Tiptronic, with less then 1100 on the Odo. And it was fully loaded. Well, my impressions between the two, granted that one was manual, and the other auto, I prefer my A4 1.8TQM over the 2.8. I felt the engine in the 2.8 was not as lively as the 1.8T. While the handeling and all that other stuff was the same, the engine just did not seem to have the get up and go of the 1.8T. The funny thing about this is that I felt the exact same way when I test drove the Passat back in December, both being Manual. I felt that the 2.8 was just not as lively as the 1.8T Passat.<br>I also put into account the extra weight of the quattro, and the fact that it is an auto, but, I should have felt the power of the engine. But it just did not seem like it was there. I am wondering if any others have felt this also.<p>ALD

I would agree with you - I think the 1.8 is much more "peppy" of an engine. Though the 2.8 is more smooth/refined. Since I do a lot of highway driving (without much traffic), the smoothness and power of the 2.8 is what I like.

I testdrove both also..<br>I felt that the 4-cyl stock was underpowered and struggled over the car's weight. Felt slow and lagged...<p>V6, baby~

you're driving a slushbox. I am constantly impressed with the power of my 2.8 manual in 2nd and 3rd gear -- I'm sure it would leave a 1.8 in the dust in the midrange. I'm afraid this is a classic apples and oranges. But hey, the good news is you like the car you own better, and that's always nice.

First, the 2.8 most definitely loosens up a lot after 4000 miles. Prior to break-in, it feels very tight.<p>Second, it is easy to perceive the additional noise and roughness of the 1.8 as speed. The 2.8 is so smooth that the perception of speed isn't as strong.<p>Third, the 1.8T does feel lively at low rpms where the 2.8 may not due to the fact that the torque curve makes peak power at 1850 rpms. Get the revs up a bit higher and the 2.8 will start to feel a lot stronger.<p>Fourth, the manual makes a HUGE difference, so you are not comparing apples to apples. Why do you think they call it a "slushbox".<p>Mike

I am a 12v owner, and i test drove a 1.8Tqm the other day, and i didn't like it at all. It felt undepowered and enimic to me. Maybe if i was coming from another 4 cylinder, i would have liked the 1.8T a little more. Who knows. But now i just can't go back. I'm addicted to the 2.8, and the feeling of having something substantial under the hood. Also, the auto is MUCH slower than the 5 speed, so i would try the manual if you get the chance. The other thing to keep in mind is that the 1.8T makes a heck of a lot more noise than the 2.8, and that may give it the impression of being more lively. Both great engines.

I felt that the throttle responce was delayed, and that the car did not pull as hard as the 1.8T. But I just realized something, maybe my 1.8T is chipped. I did buy it preowned. <br>

I'm on my second A4 loaner car, waiting on delivery of my 99.5 Avant 2.8Q (Tip, sport, leather, sunroof, Bose...all the goodies!). The first loaner was a 98.5 2.8 FWD Tip Avant. I had it for about a week and absolutely loved the way it drove and handled, in spite of its lack of quattro and the sports package. It pulled smoothly and strongly from a stop to redline in all gears (at least those I got through). The motor was quiet and torquey. Unfortunately they sold it out from under me (it went for just under 29K!) and replaced it with a 97 1.8T FWD auto - not Tiptronic. I've been driving this car for almost three weeks now. Don't get me wrong in the following, I don't mean to offend anyone, and the loaner is a free car for me until my Avant arrives, but this thing is a bit of a dog. The 0 - 30 accelleration is pathetic. You put your foot down and nearly nothing happens (bridge to engine room, full speed ahead, sometime today please). From about 30 or 35 on, it gets quicker, however, and starts acting like an Audi A4. Even with the higher-speed quickness, the motor is loud and rough in comparison with the 2.8. I'd never be happy with this drive train combination. <p>The Tip appears to be a substantial improvement over its predecessor, from what I observed test driving two 1.8 Avants and two similarly-equipped Passats. I did like those, but in the end found the 2.8 to suit my tastes much better. I'm sure a comparison between cars with manual transmissions would improve my impression of the 1.8T: there's so much enthusiasm here for that motor, especially when chipped, that there no doubt is much fun to be had there. Bottom line for me: given that I have to have an automatic (too much stop & go clutching drives my lower back crazy) the 2.8 is the best choice.<br>

I've been trying for three weeks to locate a 1.8TQM Avant Black/Onyx leatherette and having very little luck. I've been reading here during that time and have heard almost nothing but the 1.8 owners winning out over the 2.8 champions. I started considering the 2.8 today because we found a beautiful 2.8 Black/Onyx leather. And suddenly, all this talk about the 2.8 being better. I realize this is a largely subjective area and that the 1.8 owners that are really enthusiastic have chipped their cars, so the question becomes this: 1.8 chipped to 210+hp or 2.8 chipped to 210+hp? Let's talk apples to apples here.<p> (Yes, I would love to supercharge it to 280 but $$$$ on top of higher 2.8 costs begins to add up and I plan on staying married!).

I ordered my 99.5 1.8tqms last month and they said delivery was some time in September. My question is how did you get a free loaner? How far away is your delivery time? I'd love to have an A4 now to play, I mean drive around in. :) Especially since my stick driving skills aren't the greatest.<p>Thanks,<p>Andreas

The 2.8 is more smooth and quiet. And the 210hp from the 2.8 is non-force-induced, so it should feel more powerful. Plus, how long can the 1.8T turbo handle the 210hp output before running into problems? Also, the 2.8 has less high revving involved. But if you like high revs and a louder engine sound, go for the 1.8. The 2.8 sound is muffled, but you can get a new exhaust to fix that.

The free loaners are a result of the extra long period I've had to wait for my car (ordered it in late December, its now somewhere between the port and the dealer! Only a few more days...) and the exceptional salesman and dealer I'm working with: Alex Souvran at Miramar Audi in San Diego. No shame here at giving them a plug, as there was absolutely no explicit or implicit agreement that they would provide a car if mine took a long time in arriving. They provided the first A4 after about 4 1/2 months. I will have driven their Audis at no charge for over a month by the time mine arrives.<p>I'm not generally a fan of car salespeople or dealerships, and have found most to be unreliable, ignorant of the vehicles they sell, and more than once downright dishonest . Alex and co. at Miramar have been a very pleasant excpetion. He knew more than I did about the car (in contrast to all the VW sales folks I encountered when looking at Passats), and was calm and polite during the period when we were negotiating the deal. He's gone out of his way to keep me informed at every step of this excrutiatingly long waiting period. End of shameless plug.<br>

No one argues that the 1.8t with an automatic is slow. Everyone agrees that you should consider the 2.8 if your getting a slushbox that's gonna soak up the power. The debate is about a MANUAL 1.8t (different gearing) vs. the 2.8.<p>ALD compared a manual 1.8t vs an automatic 2.8. Not really fair BUT if you are getting a manual OR if you consider the price differential then it may make sense to compare. <p>Mitch 99.5 1.8tqmsa

I did. I don't have mine that long (only 700 miles) but I am impressed with how much pull the car has at 75 on the highway. My previous car was an Infiniti I30 Touring Edition and one thing it did have was that great six cylinder Nissan engine. After being used to that great Nissan six I am happily surprised at how strong the little 1.8t is on the highway. I bet with a full bar chip the 1.8t is a killer once it's spooled up at highway speeds. I say that based upon driving the Saab 9-3 turbo and being very impressed with its highway pickup.<p>I also agree that some of the enjoyment of the 1.8t seems to come from the sound. You 2.8 folks make it seem like getting a charge out of the sound of the engine is a bad thing. It's been putting a smile on my face - and that isn't a bad thing.<p>Mitch 99.5 1.8tqmsa

There is almost a 2 second difference in 0-60 MPH in wimp stick vs. manual. From '98 Audi lit:<p>1.8Q 8.1 sec manual vs. 9.8 sec wimp stick<br>2.8Q 7.1 sec manual vs. 8.8 sec wimp stick<p>Also, combo of 4-banger with manual tranny is not as smooth as 2.8 with wimp stick. So, the 1.8 manual FEELS quicker.

0 to 60 1.8Tqm ( 8.1 seconds) 2.8q tip 8.8 seconds)<br>Tiptronic does take some power away plus I believe the 1.8T is geared a little different. Check RPM at say 60 MPH you will find the 1.8T turn more RPM's.<br>Roy M